From roseingram at shaw.ca Mon Jan 4 00:33:26 2010 From: roseingram at shaw.ca (Rose Ingram) Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 00:33:26 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Red Cross in Germany Message-ID: <000801ca8d18$95c86430$6601a8c0@duocore> Happy New Year everyone. Time to get back to normal and do some research. (grin). I have an query from a young man in the United States, whose mother was adopted in Germany about 1965 at two years of age. Her birth surname was Herzog. I'm unable to help this young man. Does anyone know if the Red Cross in Germany would be able to help in this situation. Does anyone know who he could contact for assistance? Thanks, Rose Ingram From Gerhard.Koenig at gmx.net Mon Jan 4 03:39:15 2010 From: Gerhard.Koenig at gmx.net (Gerhard Koenig) Date: Mon, 04 Jan 2010 12:39:15 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] adoptions (was: Red Cross in Germany) Message-ID: <20100104113915.107190@gmx.net> Happy New Year everyone. > Red Cross in Germany Rose, I'm very unshure, if the Red Cross can help in this situation. > whose mother was adopted in Germany about 1965 at two years of age. The researcher need the birthplace and -date. This young data collect in the "Standesamt" of birthplace. About adoptions he can try to ask in the "Jugendamt" of the same birthplace. gerhard -- Take part + Read - http://wolhynien.de Informations + Questions - http://forum.wolhynien.net Museum in Linstow - http://umsiedlermuseum.wolhynien.de Historical Society - http://historischerverein.wolhynien.de -- Preisknaller: GMX DSL Flatrate f?r nur 16,99 Euro/mtl.! http://portal.gmx.net/de/go/dsl02 From Spaghettitree at aol.com Mon Jan 4 04:52:28 2010 From: Spaghettitree at aol.com (Spaghettitree@aol.com) Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 07:52:28 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Red Cross in Germany Message-ID: German Red Cross addresses: Deutsches Rotes Kreuz Generalsekretariat Suchdienst Hamburg Amandastra?e 74 20357 Hamburg tel: 040- 432-02-0 \fax: 040- 432-02-200 email _DRK-Suchdienst-Hamburg at drk-sdhh.de_ (mailto:DRK-Suchdienst-Hamburg at drk-sdhh.de) Duetsches Rotes Kreuz Generalsekretariat Suchdienst M?nchen Chiemgaustra?e 109 81549 M?nchen tel. 089- 60-773-0 fax 089-680-745-92 email: _DRK-Suchdienst-Muenchen at t-online.de_ (mailto:DRK-Suchdienst-Muenchen at t-online.de) Inquiries should be written in German. Herzog is not an unusual name (means Duchy) so sending a photo may help. Maureen Schoenky In a message dated 1/4/2010 12:36:55 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, roseingram at shaw.ca writes: Happy New Year everyone. Time to get back to normal and do some research. (grin). I have an query from a young man in the United States, whose mother was adopted in Germany about 1965 at two years of age. Her birth surname was Herzog. I'm unable to help this young man. Does anyone know if the Red Cross in Germany would be able to help in this situation. Does anyone know who he could contact for assistance? Thanks, Rose Ingram _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From GHBoehm at ish.de Mon Jan 4 05:41:18 2010 From: GHBoehm at ish.de (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=FCnther_B=F6hm?=) Date: Mon, 04 Jan 2010 14:41:18 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Barons & Baronettes In-Reply-To: <293C3DE3084147B89594890BF3D77DA6@LloydPC> References: <293C3DE3084147B89594890BF3D77DA6@LloydPC> Message-ID: <4B41EFFE.8050902@ish.de> Lloyd Friedrick schrieb: > Some old letters from my Volhynian relatives refer to our great great grandfather Gottlieb Thrun was known as Baron von Thrun. > > A reference in the Odessa site does list him as an landowner near Stettin in old Pomerania. > > My view is that the title Baron in the late 1700 - early 1800 simply expressed the fact that the person was a freeholder of land rather than a member of the Aristocracy of the day. > Many of the younger members of my family of being descendents of the title and their desire to be descended from Royalty. > I would like to advise them of lesser expectations from this simple reference in our heritage. > > Would others on this listserve help me with this issue of explaining a Baron to my young generation. > > lloyd friedrick in Victoria Hello Lloyd, do you consider it possible that he was a *Prussian* nobleman? In Prussia the title was Freiherr instead of Baron [the latter deriving from Latin / Celtic "liber baro" = free man]. A Freiherr was nearly as much as a Graf [count] and member of the high nobility. There was no THRUN at all in the Prussian or German high nobility. - Instead lots of THURN [Grafen v.THURN, VALSASSINA, COMO und VERCELLI] and THUN / THUNN [Grafen v.THUN und HOHENSTEIN, Grafen v.ZHUN-HOHENSTEIN-SALM-REIFFERSCHEIDT / v.THUN-SALM, Grafen THUNN v.CASTEL THUNN]. 1. In Jassen and Klein Pomeiske, Kreis B?tow, Pomerania, a THRUN (no nobility) was forester in 1750. In Jassen, Carl THRUN and Maria Dorothea THRUN were godparents in 1838, Johann THRUN in 1840, Friedrich THRUN in 1860. 2. In Zukowken, Kreis B?tow, Pomerania, a THRUN family (no nobility) lived in 1906. 3. In Buchwalde, Kreis B?tow, Pomerania, the name THRUN (no nobility) existed up to 1945. 4. In Klein Gustkow, Kreis B?tow, Pomerania, Friedrich THRUN (no nobility) was a blacksmith fellow in 1839. 5. Joachim THRUN edited the book "Informationen zur Familien- und Heimatforschung im Kreis Rummelsburg in Pommern" in 2000 G?nther From hgillespie at rogers.com Mon Jan 4 06:58:14 2010 From: hgillespie at rogers.com (Helen Gillespie) Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 06:58:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Red Cross in Germany In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <559174.64749.qm@web88005.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi all, It is very possible that the German Red Cross might have been involved in adoptions - after the war years, but more recently, I'd suggest the person Google " adoption Germany". There are a number of hits and most importantly there is an agency that registers both adoptees and birth parents. Any of these links might prove more fruitful than the Red Cross. IMHO Helen Gillespie --- On Mon, 1/4/10, Spaghettitree at aol.com wrote: > From: Spaghettitree at aol.com > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Red Cross in Germany > To: roseingram at shaw.ca, ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Date: Monday, January 4, 2010, 12:52 PM > German Red Cross addresses: > > Deutsches Rotes Kreuz > Generalsekretariat > Suchdienst Hamburg > Amandastra?e 74 > 20357 Hamburg > tel: 040- 432-02-0 > \fax: 040- 432-02-200 > email _DRK-Suchdienst-Hamburg at drk-sdhh.de_ > > (mailto:DRK-Suchdienst-Hamburg at drk-sdhh.de) > > > Duetsches Rotes Kreuz > Generalsekretariat > Suchdienst M?nchen > Chiemgaustra?e 109 > 81549 M?nchen > tel. 089- 60-773-0 > fax 089-680-745-92 > email: _DRK-Suchdienst-Muenchen at t-online.de_ > > (mailto:DRK-Suchdienst-Muenchen at t-online.de)??? > > Inquiries should be written in German.? Herzog is not > an unusual name? > (means Duchy) so sending a photo may help. > > Maureen Schoenky > > > In a message dated 1/4/2010 12:36:55 A.M. Pacific Standard > Time,? > roseingram at shaw.ca > writes: > > Happy? New Year everyone. > > Time to get back to normal and do some? > research.? (grin). > > I have an query from a young man in the United? > States, whose mother was > adopted in Germany about 1965 at two years of? > age.? Her birth surname was > Herzog. > > I'm unable to help this young? > man.???Does anyone know if the Red Cross in > Germany would be able to? help in this > situation.? Does anyone know who he > could contact for? assistance? > > Thanks, > > Rose? Ingram > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia? Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe? http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at? http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From roseingram at shaw.ca Mon Jan 4 11:20:39 2010 From: roseingram at shaw.ca (Rose Ingram) Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 11:20:39 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] adoptions (was: Red Cross in Germany) References: <20100104113915.107190@gmx.net> Message-ID: <005801ca8d73$0082d490$6601a8c0@duocore> Thank you to everyone who replied. As this young man does not have internet access, I'm going to suggest to him to contact/phone the German Embassy closest to him who may be able to do something on his behalf or direct him to the proper authorities. Rose Ingram From: Gerhard Koenig To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 3:39 AM Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] adoptions (was: Red Cross in Germany) Happy New Year everyone. > Red Cross in Germany Rose, I'm very unshure, if the Red Cross can help in this situation. > whose mother was adopted in Germany about 1965 at two years of age. The researcher need the birthplace and -date. This young data collect in the "Standesamt" of birthplace. About adoptions he can try to ask in the "Jugendamt" of the same birthplace. gerhard From ra_stein at telus.net Mon Jan 4 11:53:48 2010 From: ra_stein at telus.net (Richard Stein) Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 12:53:48 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] adoptions (was: Red Cross in Germany) In-Reply-To: <005801ca8d73$0082d490$6601a8c0@duocore> References: <20100104113915.107190@gmx.net> <005801ca8d73$0082d490$6601a8c0@duocore> Message-ID: <82F5AB14507844D1A87742764C98214B@RichardPC> Rose, The German Red Cross was very helpful 7 years ago when I inquired about my Brandt family who became refugees in Germany in 1945. They had lived previously in Polish Volhynia and were resettled to the Warthegau in 1940. I wrote in English with all the information I had including the EWZ documents. I wrote to Deutsches Rotes Kreuz Suchdienst Am Sandwerder 3 D - 14109 Berlin Deutschland and received a reply from Deutsches Rotes Kreuz Generalsekretariat, Suchdienst Muenchen Chiemgaustr. 109 D - 81549 Muenchen Deutschland Dick Stein ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rose Ingram" To: Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 12:20 PM Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] adoptions (was: Red Cross in Germany) > Thank you to everyone who replied. > > As this young man does not have internet access, I'm going to suggest to > him to contact/phone the German Embassy closest to him who may be able to > do something on his behalf or direct him to the proper authorities. > > Rose Ingram > > From: Gerhard Koenig > To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 3:39 AM > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] adoptions (was: Red Cross in Germany) > > > Happy New Year everyone. > > > Red Cross in Germany > > Rose, I'm very unshure, if the Red Cross can help in this situation. > > > whose mother was adopted in Germany about 1965 at two years of age. > > The researcher need the birthplace and -date. This young data collect in > the "Standesamt" of birthplace. About adoptions he can try to ask in the > "Jugendamt" of the same birthplace. > > gerhard > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From marmel at pctcnet.net Mon Jan 4 19:04:16 2010 From: marmel at pctcnet.net (marmel) Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 21:04:16 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Herzog surname Message-ID: <8B412CBAE65C430C8770AC528A52C13D@marmelPC> HERZOG research: I have the surname HERZOG in my research database from the Lutheran Church records of Czerniejewo, Poland (aka Schwarzenau, Provinz Posan, West Prussia) with 2 females, one born in 1853 in the village of Grabowo, Wielkopolskie, Poland (just NE of Gnesen), and one married in 1865. I don't know how common the surname is, but it is one I hadn't heard previously. Perhaps it was a common surname to the Posan area in mid 1800s? This area of the Czerniejewo Lutheran Church encompassed an area of current day Poland located east and slightly northeast of the city of Poznan. It was German Prussian in the 1800's, and on the border between West Prussia and Poland or Russia. In case anyone else is researching the HERZOG surname, the names I have are: LDS microfilm #1960606: Geborren [Births] 1853; Record #005: birthplace: Grabowo hauf; child's name: HERZOG, Ottilie Caroline; born: 17 Jan 1853; baptized: 17 Jan; father: Christlieb HERZOG, wirsh.; mother: Anna Caroline geb. STEINKE; godparents: 1) Johann August Rieske, junggesell, 2) Anna Juliana Steinke, jungfer, 3) Anna Maria SCHULZ, ehefrau Ottilie Caroline HERZOG born: 17 Jan 1853 in Grabowo, Wielkopolskie, Poland baptized: 17 Jan 1853 in Czerniejewo, Wielkopolskie, Poland parents: Christlieb HERZOG & Anna Caroline STEINKE LDS microfilm #0810530: Getraute [Marriages] 1865; Record #11 Anna Justine HERZOG, age 21y 2m born: Jun/Jul 1844 Grabowo, Wielkopolskie, Poland father: Michael HERZOG, einwohner, deceased married: 03 Sep 1865 in the Lutheran Church, Czerniejewo, Wielkopolskie, Poland spouse: Ludwig SCHACHTSCHNEIDER, age 27 (born 1838, Nekla haul, Wielkopolskie, Poland); note: 2nd marriage to Auguste HERZOG The referenced surnames STEINKE and SCHACHTSCHNEIDER (listed above) are related to the surname SCHULZ, which is my ancestry. Linda in Wisconsin, USA From GHBoehm at ish.de Tue Jan 5 00:08:38 2010 From: GHBoehm at ish.de (=?UTF-8?B?R8O8bnRoZXIgQsO2aG0=?=) Date: Tue, 05 Jan 2010 09:08:38 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Herzog surname In-Reply-To: <8B412CBAE65C430C8770AC528A52C13D@marmelPC> References: <8B412CBAE65C430C8770AC528A52C13D@marmelPC> Message-ID: <4B42F386.4050307@ish.de> marmel schrieb: > HERZOG research: > > I have the surname HERZOG in my research database from the Lutheran Church records of Czerniejewo, Poland (aka Schwarzenau, Provinz Posan, West Prussia) with 2 females, one born in 1853 in the village of Grabowo, Wielkopolskie, Poland (just NE of Gnesen), and one married in 1865. I don't know how common the surname is, but it is one I hadn't heard previously. Perhaps it was a common surname to the Posan area in mid 1800s? This area of the Czerniejewo Lutheran Church encompassed an area of current day Poland located east and slightly northeast of the city of Poznan. Hello Linda, HERZOG was indeed a very common name in this area. The Posen Projekt (marriages database) returns 103 exact hits, 18 of them in Schwarzenau: Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 19 / 1826 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Andreas Rieske (27) Vater: Christian Anna Rosina Herzog (23) Vater: Christlieb Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 4 / 1827 Punktzahl: Br?utigam: 100% Christlieb Herzog (26) Vater: Christlieb Anna Caroline Steinke (18) Vater: Paul Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 2 / 1830 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Gottfried Somerfeld (29) Vater: Johann Louise Herzog (24) Vater: Christlieb Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 21 / 1830 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Daniel Behnke (28) Vater: Peter Anna Elisabeth Herzog (20) Vater: Christlieb Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 12 / 1833 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Daniel Zippel (35) Vater: Gottfried Anna Susanne Herzog (19) Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 4 / 1837 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% August Seel (26) Vater: Wilhelm Anna Susanne Zippel geb. Herzog (22) Zus?tzliche Information: widow Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 5 / 1837 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Martin Kaempf (25) Vater: Thomas Anna Dorothea Herzog (21) Vater: Christlieb Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 6 / 1837 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Andreas Kelm (23) Vater: Christian Anna Louise Sommerfeld geb. Herzog (27) Zus?tzliche Information: widow Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 15 / 1841 Punktzahl: Br?utigam: 100% Michael Herzog (31) Vater: Christlieb Anna Dorothea Busse (28) Vater: Gottfried Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 8 / 1843 Punktzahl: Br?utigam: 100% Gottfried Herzog (26) Vater: Christlieb Anna Christine Steinke (21) Vater: Paul Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 14 / 1846 Punktzahl: Br?utigam: 100% Johann Christoph Herzog (26 7/12) Vater: Christlieb Anna Louise Braun (18 1/12) Vater: Gottlieb Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 2 / 1849 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Michael Klingbeil (46) Vater: Christoph Anna Caroline Herzog (26) Vater: Christlieb Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 19 / 1856 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Christoph Karnecki (22) Vater: Christoph Anna Susanne Seel geb. Herzog (39) Zus?tzliche Information: widow of Johann August Seel Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 11 / 1865 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Ludwig Schachtschneider (27) Vater: Gottlieb Anna Justine Herzog (21 1/6) Vater: Michael Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 11 / 1868 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Johann Gottfried Braun (59 7/12) Elisabeth Behnke geb. Herzog (55 7/12) Zus?tzliche Information: widower/widow of Daniel Behnke Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 16 / 1870 Punktzahl: Br?utigam: 100% Gottfried Herzog (55) Anna Justine Russ (24 1/3) Vater: Georg Zus?tzliche Information: widower Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 4 / 1871 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Johann Eduard Knappe (22 1/2) Vater: Carl Auguste Wilhelmine Herzog (21 3/4) Vater: Christoph Evangelische Gemeinde in Czerniejewo [Schwarzenau], Eintrag 7 / 1888 Punktzahl: Braut: 100% Ludwig Troelenberg (43 3/4) Auguste Wilhelmine Knappe geb. Herzog (39 1/2) Zus?tzliche Information: widower/divorced Its original meaning is duke and probably the first bearer was in service of a duke. Since there are also lots of Polish versions of the name (HERCOG [actually 62 times in the Pozna? region] HERCYK, HERCZEK etc.), a more specific research may be advisible. > The referenced surnames STEINKE and SCHACHTSCHNEIDER (listed above) are related to the surname SCHULZ, which is my ancestry. > Also the SCHULZ surname is a very common name in Germany and was very common in the Posen region. G?nther From brackman at telus.net Mon Jan 4 16:42:24 2010 From: brackman at telus.net (David Brackman) Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 16:42:24 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow / Volhynia Message-ID: Hello, My Grandfather was born in 1880 in Freidland Mecklenburg, his name was Erich Brachmann. he came to Canada ( Calgary, Alberta) around 1900.Shortly after he arrived he changed his name to Brackman to make it less German sounding! He married Julia Schneider and had 5 children, he died in 1919. we know he had a sister but that is all, she never came to Canada. Perhaps there is some relation there. Happy new Year and best regards David Brackman Vancouver, Canada From brackman at telus.net Mon Jan 4 17:05:32 2010 From: brackman at telus.net (David Brackman) Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 17:05:32 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Brachmann, Schneider alberta Canada Message-ID: <379AC6C4DF33472B93B7E5DEDB1E7C40@DavidLaptop> Hello List, I have read with interest many family stories such as mine: My Grandfather, Erich Brachmann was born in Freidland Mecklenburg in 1880 he came to Calgary Canada around 1900. after he arrived he met and married Julia Schneider, she was from one of the German colonies near Oddessa in Russia. We know very little of her family history. We do know that Erich had a sister in Germany. Erich changed the spelling of his surname to Brackman shortly after he arrived to make it sound less German. Erich and Julia had 5 children, Erich died in Calgary Alberta in 1918. If anyone has any knowledge or connections would love to hear. many thanks David Brackman From ldholewa at shaw.ca Tue Jan 5 06:30:02 2010 From: ldholewa at shaw.ca (Linda Holewa) Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2010 07:30:02 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Radke Message-ID: <6A5ACE7A84DD406BB17E48283B15752C@winxppro> Hi I am looking for the descendants of George Radke who married Christina Kreuken and he remarried Wilhelmine Krinke.. I am looking for more informations on his one of children, Michael Radke who married Florentina Silk. Regards Linda From joepessarra at suddenlink.net Tue Jan 5 14:26:03 2010 From: joepessarra at suddenlink.net (Joseph Pessarra) Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2010 16:26:03 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow / Volhynia In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001701ca8e56$10f1bc90$32d535b0$@net> Believe the name of the town is Friedland. Germany telephone directory at http://www.dastelefonbuch.de/ has one Brachmann listed for Friedland, Mecklenburg-Vorpommern. Heinrich Brachmann, 17098 Friedland, phone 039601-2-00-63. There are 7 listings of Brachmann within about 60 km (36 miles) of Friedland. Maybe some letters to these people would get you some answers for your search. Good luck, Joe in Texas -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of David Brackman Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 6:42 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow / Volhynia Hello, My Grandfather was born in 1880 in Freidland Mecklenburg, his name was Erich Brachmann. he came to Canada ( Calgary, Alberta) around 1900.Shortly after he arrived he changed his name to Brackman to make it less German sounding! He married Julia Schneider and had 5 children, he died in 1919. we know he had a sister but that is all, she never came to Canada. Perhaps there is some relation there. Happy new Year and best regards David Brackman Vancouver, Canada _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From roseingram at shaw.ca Tue Jan 5 18:04:48 2010 From: roseingram at shaw.ca (Rose Ingram) Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2010 18:04:48 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Radke References: <6A5ACE7A84DD406BB17E48283B15752C@winxppro> Message-ID: <001a01ca8e74$a02cc6c0$6601a8c0@duocore> Hi Linda, In what time period did these people live, and where - Poland or Volhynia or ?? Rose Ingram ----- Original Message ----- From: Linda Holewa To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2010 6:30 AM Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Radke Hi I am looking for the descendants of George Radke who married Christina Kreuken and he remarried Wilhelmine Krinke.. I am looking for more informations on his one of children, Michael Radke who married Florentina Silk. Regards Linda _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From gmason001 at comcast.net Tue Jan 5 18:59:04 2010 From: gmason001 at comcast.net (Greg Mason) Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2010 21:59:04 -0500 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow / Volhynia In-Reply-To: <001701ca8e56$10f1bc90$32d535b0$@net> References: <001701ca8e56$10f1bc90$32d535b0$@net> Message-ID: <331C5472-7A4F-469F-B531-006624821879@comcast.net> Joe and others on the list: I used this technique that Joe describes some years ago to locate my wife's second cousin. I sent 26 letters to people with the same surname listed in the Deutsche Post directory for a particular town. Within three weeks we received a letter from the cousin (who now has a married surname, different from the names to whom we sent the letters) and the contact has since developed into a wonderful friendship between my wife and her cousin. So, even though it may seam like a stretch, its worth a shot. Greg Mason On Jan 5, 2010, at 5:26 PM, Joseph Pessarra wrote: > Believe the name of the town is Friedland. Germany telephone directory at > http://www.dastelefonbuch.de/ has one Brachmann listed for Friedland, > Mecklenburg-Vorpommern. > > Heinrich Brachmann, 17098 Friedland, phone 039601-2-00-63. > > There are 7 listings of Brachmann within about 60 km (36 miles) of > Friedland. > > Maybe some letters to these people would get you some answers for your > search. > > Good luck, > > Joe in Texas > > -----Original Message----- > From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org > [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of David > Brackman > Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 6:42 PM > To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow / > Volhynia > > Hello, My Grandfather was born in 1880 in Freidland Mecklenburg, his name > was Erich Brachmann. he came to Canada ( Calgary, Alberta) around > 1900.Shortly after he arrived he changed his name to Brackman to make it > less German sounding! He married Julia Schneider and had 5 children, he died > in 1919. we know he had a sister but that is all, she never came to Canada. > Perhaps there is some relation there. > > Happy new Year and best regards > > David Brackman > Vancouver, Canada > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From tomjess64 at comcast.net Tue Jan 5 20:19:46 2010 From: tomjess64 at comcast.net (tomjess64@comcast.net) Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2010 04:19:46 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow / Volhynia In-Reply-To: <331C5472-7A4F-469F-B531-006624821879@comcast.net> Message-ID: <435056013.4059881262751586456.JavaMail.root@sz0103a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> It worked for me also. I started calling Rode's in Hamburg and on my 3rd call, found a relative, Harry Rode. His father, who passed away in 1969, had done a lot of family research and he sent me all the information. It easily doubled the information I allready had. I'm looking forward to meeting Harry hopefully this year or next. I tried the same technique for other branches, family names, but was unsuccessful, however, everyone I talked to was very friendly and understood the desire to find lost relatives. Tom Jess ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Mason" To: "Joseph Pessarra" Cc: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2010 9:59:04 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow /????????Volhynia Joe and others on the list: ?I used this technique that Joe describes some years ago to locate my wife's second cousin. ?I sent 26 letters to people with the same surname listed in the Deutsche Post directory for a particular town. ?Within three weeks we received a letter from the cousin (who now has a married surname, different from the names to whom we sent the letters) and the contact has since developed into a wonderful friendship between my wife and her cousin. ?So, even though it may seam like a stretch, its worth a shot. ?Greg Mason On Jan 5, 2010, at 5:26 PM, Joseph Pessarra wrote: > Believe the name of the town is Friedland. ?Germany telephone directory at > http://www.dastelefonbuch.de/ ?has one Brachmann listed for Friedland, > Mecklenburg-Vorpommern. > > Heinrich Brachmann, 17098 Friedland, phone 039601-2-00-63. > > There are 7 listings of Brachmann within about 60 km (36 miles) of > Friedland. > > Maybe some letters to these people would get you some answers for your > search. > > Good luck, > > Joe in Texas > > -----Original Message----- > From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org > [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of David > Brackman > Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 6:42 PM > To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow / > Volhynia > > Hello, My Grandfather was born in 1880 in Freidland Mecklenburg, his name > was Erich Brachmann. ?he came to Canada ( Calgary, Alberta) around > 1900.Shortly after he arrived he changed his name to Brackman to make it > less German sounding! He married Julia Schneider and had 5 children, he died > in 1919. ?we know he had a sister but that is all, she never came to Canada. > Perhaps there is some relation there. > > Happy new ?Year and best regards > > David Brackman > Vancouver, Canada > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From joepessarra at suddenlink.net Tue Jan 5 20:50:32 2010 From: joepessarra at suddenlink.net (joepessarra) Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2010 22:50:32 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow / Volhynia In-Reply-To: <435056013.4059881262751586456.JavaMail.root@sz0103a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <331C5472-7A4F-469F-B531-006624821879@comcast.net> <435056013.4059881262751586456.JavaMail.root@sz0103a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <001c01ca8e8b$c72e5060$558af120$@net> I appreciate the supporting messages. We had only a photo of a small village in Bavaria, with German writing on the back that said, ?The town of Utzenhofen near Amberg, the post of which comes through Kastl, where Theresa Beer spent her childhood.? Theresa was my grandmother. A letter was written to the postmaster in Kastl, asking if there were any people still living in the area by the name of Beer or Schuster (my grandfather?s name). The postmaster sent the letter to the postmaster in Kastl. He had been postmaster there for many years. But, he could not read English. A neighbor transcribed it for him, and he said, ?Yes, there are families still living here with those names. My mother was a Beer, and there is a Schuster descendant a block away!? The postmaster was my cousin, and so was the Schuster descendant. My wife and I have spent many days on numerous trips there to visit with those families. We had the same results with both of my other grandparents families, Pessarra and Conrady. With letters in the past year to families in South Africa, we have located some of my wife?s distant relatives. So, good luck to all of you on your contacts. Don?t give up. You will get some results. Joe in Texas From: tomjess64 at comcast.net [mailto:tomjess64 at comcast.net] Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2010 10:20 PM To: Greg Mason Cc: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org; Joseph Pessarra Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow / Volhynia It worked for me also. I started calling Rode's in Hamburg and on my 3rd call, found a relative, Harry Rode. His father, who passed away in 1969, had done a lot of family research and he sent me all the information. It easily doubled the information I allready had. I'm looking forward to meeting Harry hopefully this year or next. I tried the same technique for other branches, family names, but was unsuccessful, however, everyone I talked to was very friendly and understood the desire to find lost relatives. Tom Jess ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Mason" To: "Joseph Pessarra" Cc: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2010 9:59:04 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow / Volhynia Joe and others on the list: I used this technique that Joe describes some years ago to locate my wife's second cousin. I sent 26 letters to people with the same surname listed in the Deutsche Post directory for a particular town. Within three weeks we received a letter from the cousin (who now has a married surname, different from the names to whom we sent the letters) and the contact has since developed into a wonderful friendship between my wife and her cousin. So, even though it may seam like a stretch, its worth a shot. Greg Mason On Jan 5, 2010, at 5:26 PM, Joseph Pessarra wrote: > Believe the name of the town is Friedland. Germany telephone directory at > http://www.dastelefonbuch.de/ has one Brachmann listed for Friedland, > Mecklenburg-Vorpommern. > > Heinrich Brachmann, 17098 Friedland, phone 039601-2-00-63. > > There are 7 listings of Brachmann within about 60 km (36 miles) of > Friedland. > > Maybe some letters to these people would get you some answers for your > search. > > Good luck, > > Joe in Texas > > -----Original Message----- > From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org > [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of David > Brackman > Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 6:42 PM > To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family BRACHMANN from Dombrowa and Romanow / > Volhynia > > Hello, My Grandfather was born in 1880 in Freidland Mecklenburg, his name > was Erich Brachmann. he came to Canada ( Calgary, Alberta) around > 1900.Shortly after he arrived he changed his name to Brackman to make it > less German sounding! He married Julia Schneider and had 5 children, he died > in 1919. we know he had a sister but that is all, she never came to Canada. > Perhaps there is some relation there. > > Happy new Year and best regards > > David Brackman > Vancouver, Canada > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From Krampetz at aol.com Tue Jan 5 21:19:23 2010 From: Krampetz at aol.com (Krampetz@aol.com) Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2010 00:19:23 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Radke Message-ID: It would help if you know more dates and villages. Radke is not a very uncommon name, there are 1,618 with that surname in the SGGEE data base. I.E. There was a Wilhelmina Radke that was listed as 'family' in 1902 at the Lipno church during confirmation of Matylda Krampitz, b: 1887.. That I'm interested in. Bob Krampetz, searching for: Krampic, Krampitz, Barany, kr Lipno area 1850-1945 Eggert, Egert, Elgert, Ilgert, Turza Wilcza, kr Lipno area 1850-1945 In a message dated 1/5/2010 1:58:48 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, ldholewa at shaw.ca writes: Hi I am looking for the descendants of George Radke who married Christina Kreuken and he remarried Wilhelmine Krinke.. I am looking for more informations on his one of children, Michael Radke who married Florentina Silk. Regards Linda From tomjess64 at comcast.net Wed Jan 6 00:34:55 2010 From: tomjess64 at comcast.net (tomjess64@comcast.net) Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2010 08:34:55 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Radke In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1627496246.4101771262766895958.JavaMail.root@sz0103a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> I have a wilhelmine radke married to martin jesse in my family, although that was early 1800's. 4 children, gottlieb, justine, wilhelmine, and caroline jesse. If that helps at all. Tom Jess ----- Original Message ----- From: Krampetz at aol.com To: ldholewa at shaw.ca, ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2010 12:19:23 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Radke ? It would help if you know more dates and villages. ? Radke is not ?a very uncommon name, ?there are 1,618 with that surname in the SGGEE data ?base. ? I.E. ?There was a Wilhelmina Radke that was listed as 'family' in ?1902 at the Lipno church during confirmation of Matylda Krampitz, b: ?1887.. ? That I'm interested in. ? Bob Krampetz, searching for: Krampic, Krampitz, ?Barany, kr Lipno area ? 1850-1945 ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?Eggert, Egert, Elgert, Ilgert, ?Turza Wilcza, kr Lipno area ?1850-1945 ? ? In a message dated 1/5/2010 1:58:48 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, ? ldholewa at shaw.ca writes: Hi I ?am looking for the descendants of George Radke who married Christina Kreuken ?and he remarried Wilhelmine Krinke.. I am looking for more informations on ?his one of children, Michael Radke who married Florentina ?Silk. Regards Linda _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From dproper at charter.net Wed Jan 6 20:27:20 2010 From: dproper at charter.net (Dave Proper) Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2010 20:27:20 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Volhynia place names In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi All, I have started the process of standardizing my Polish and Volhynian place names according to the new SGGEE Guidelines for places. Thus far I have done the easy ones and now am getting to the last few that are much harder to resolve. My current quandary is the all-to-common multiple place names that can exist with in a very small area. Case-in-point: I have a Gustave Adolph Kugler, b. 29 Oct 1871. Before it was easy - he was simply born in Bolarka, Volhynia (from the St Petersburg Consistory records). Now the gazetteer for Volhynia presents me with six choices to nail down the specific location: 1)Bolarka (Bialogrodka/Bilohorodka), Dubno, Rivne, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 501837 253247 2)Bolarka (Sosnowa-Bolarka/Vesnianka), Chervonoarmiisk, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 503411 281616 3)Bolarka-Radecka (Radziecka-Bolarka/Radetska Boliarka), Chervonoarmiisk, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 503524 281513 4)Boljarka (Balarka/Boliarka), Novohrad-Volynskyi, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 503030 274530 5)Boljarka (Bolarka Stara/Boliarka), Zhytomyr, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 501938 282127 6)Boljarka (Bolarka-Prosiecka/Boliarka), Yemilchyne, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 505100 273900 My first thought was "where were his siblings born?" An older brother, a younger sister and two younger brothers were all born in Glueckstal (all from the St Petes records). So which of the Bolarka's is the closest to Glueckstal and most likely of the six? That results in a list like this: #4 - 29 km #5 - 42 km #2 - 50 km #3 - 51 km #6 - 67 km #1 - 171 km So now I am leaning towards #4 but still looking for something further to tie it to that place. I looked at the Volhynian parish formation list http://www.sggee.org/research/parishes/parish_histories/VolhynianParishesDia gram.pdf and in the year 1871 there were four parishes - Shitomir, Kiev, Rozyszcze and Heimtal so that doesn't seem to provide and any further refinement. Without any further information a reasonable person would opt for Bolarka #4. Does anyone have further insight as to how to make the selection? Or should the option at the bottom of page 8 of the guidelines be used - Bolarka (many found),,,Poland? Dave Proper p/s Thanks to Frank Stewner and the others who put in countless hours creating these wonderfull new research tools! From FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca Thu Jan 7 06:14:14 2010 From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca (Jerry Frank) Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 07:14:14 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Volhynia place names In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B45EC36.8000808@shaw.ca> Dave, Probably the best way to figure this out is by using our "Route of the Pastor" search function at http://www.sggee.org/members/StPeteByRoute (Members Only). The pastor would travel from village to village collecting info from the local Kantor. These villages would be in close proximity to each other. By looking at which villages were visited in sequence, and then looking on the map for that grouping, you will probably be able to figure out which is the correct Bolarka. Jerry Frank Calgary, AB Dave Proper wrote: > > Hi All, > I have started the process of standardizing my Polish and Volhynian place > names according to the new SGGEE Guidelines for places. Thus far I have done > the easy ones and now am getting to the last few that are much harder to > resolve. My current quandary is the all-to-common multiple place names that > can exist with in a very small area. Case-in-point: > I have a Gustave Adolph Kugler, b. 29 Oct 1871. Before it was easy - he was > simply born in Bolarka, Volhynia (from the St Petersburg Consistory > records). Now the gazetteer for Volhynia presents me with six choices to > nail down the specific location: > > 1)Bolarka (Bialogrodka/Bilohorodka), Dubno, Rivne, Russian Empire (Ukraine) > 501837 253247 > 2)Bolarka (Sosnowa-Bolarka/Vesnianka), Chervonoarmiisk, Zhytomyr, Russian > Empire (Ukraine) 503411 281616 > 3)Bolarka-Radecka (Radziecka-Bolarka/Radetska Boliarka), Chervonoarmiisk, > Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 503524 281513 > 4)Boljarka (Balarka/Boliarka), Novohrad-Volynskyi, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire > (Ukraine) 503030 274530 > 5)Boljarka (Bolarka Stara/Boliarka), Zhytomyr, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire > (Ukraine) 501938 282127 > 6)Boljarka (Bolarka-Prosiecka/Boliarka), Yemilchyne, Zhytomyr, Russian > Empire (Ukraine) 505100 273900 > > My first thought was "where were his siblings born?" An older brother, a > younger sister and two younger brothers were all born in Glueckstal (all > from the St Petes records). So which of the Bolarka's is the closest to > Glueckstal and most likely of the six? That results in a list like this: > #4 - 29 km > #5 - 42 km > #2 - 50 km > #3 - 51 km > #6 - 67 km > #1 - 171 km > > So now I am leaning towards #4 but still looking for something further to > tie it to that place. I looked at the Volhynian parish formation list > http://www.sggee.org/research/parishes/parish_histories/VolhynianParishesDia > gram.pdf > and in the year 1871 there were four parishes - Shitomir, Kiev, Rozyszcze > and Heimtal so that doesn't seem to provide and any further refinement. > > Without any further information a reasonable person would opt for Bolarka > #4. Does anyone have further insight as to how to make the selection? Or > should the option at the bottom of page 8 of the guidelines be used - > Bolarka (many found),,,Poland? > > Dave Proper > > p/s Thanks to Frank Stewner and the others who put in countless hours > creating these wonderfull new research tools! > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > From gpvjem at sasktel.net Thu Jan 7 08:29:49 2010 From: gpvjem at sasktel.net (gpvjem) Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 10:29:49 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost Message-ID: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> Request assistance in determining the location and fate of a place in Volhynia called Urichwost. I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl Seeker etc. with no results. Was there a possible name change? Apparently it was located in Luck powiat (county) but I don't know what township or tax district. Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative which is recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it was also noted with the same spelling in a very comprehensive Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of AHSGR in 1998. She was not able to provide further information other than it was in Luck county. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. Thank you, John Marsch From FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca Thu Jan 7 09:19:23 2010 From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca (Jerry Frank) Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 10:19:23 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost In-Reply-To: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> Message-ID: John, Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in another message this morning?? That will narrow down the search even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a variety of maps we have to see if it can be found.? Also, what time frame are we dealing with? Jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: gpvjem Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > ??? > ??? Request assistance in determining the > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called Urichwost.? > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl Seeker etc. > with no results.? Was there a possible name change? > ??? Apparently it was located in Luck powiat > (county) but I don't know what township or tax district.? > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative which is > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124? Registration #142 and it > was also noted with the same spelling in a very comprehensive > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of AHSGR in > 1998.? She was not able to provide further information > other than it was in Luck county. > ??? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. > > Thank you, > John Marsch > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From gpvjem at sasktel.net Thu Jan 7 11:35:55 2010 From: gpvjem at sasktel.net (gpvjem) Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 13:35:55 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> Message-ID: <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> Jerry: The date of birth of Christina Janke is recorded as 14 Nov 1863. The "Route of the Pastor" check provided nothing new. Leona Janke's sources included: Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). Maps of Volhynia Library of Congress Maps: Poland: G6520s, 100.P6 and G7010s, 100.P6 St Peterburg Volhynian records. It is entirely possible that Leona Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a legitimate spelling. On the other hand, why would she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the St Petersburg records? John ---------------------------------------------------------- From: Jerry Frank To: gpvjem Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM John, Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in another message this morning? That will narrow down the search even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what time frame are we dealing with? Jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: gpvjem Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > > Request assistance in determining the > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called Urichwost. > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl Seeker etc. > with no results. Was there a possible name change? > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat > (county) but I don't know what township or tax district. > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative which is > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it > was also noted with the same spelling in a very comprehensive > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of AHSGR in > 1998. She was not able to provide further information > other than it was in Luck county. > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. > > Thank you, > John Marsch > From joepessarra at suddenlink.net Thu Jan 7 12:06:34 2010 From: joepessarra at suddenlink.net (joepessarra) Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2010 14:06:34 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost In-Reply-To: References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> Message-ID: <000901ca8fd4$e93e8db0$bbbba910$@net> Just a possibility: Luck, Poland is at 51 26 N, 22 39 E, and Harachwosty is only 46.3 miles N of Luck. Joe in Texas -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Jerry Frank Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM To: gpvjem Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost John, Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in another message this morning?? That will narrow down the search even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a variety of maps we have to see if it can be found.? Also, what time frame are we dealing with? Jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: gpvjem Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > ??? > ??? Request assistance in determining the > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called Urichwost.? > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl Seeker etc. > with no results.? Was there a possible name change? > ??? Apparently it was located in Luck powiat > (county) but I don't know what township or tax district.? > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative which is > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124? Registration #142 and it > was also noted with the same spelling in a very comprehensive > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of AHSGR in > 1998.? She was not able to provide further information > other than it was in Luck county. > ??? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. > > Thank you, > John Marsch > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From duesterhoeft at gmx.de Thu Jan 7 12:43:35 2010 From: duesterhoeft at gmx.de (=?UTF-8?B?IlN0ZWZhbiBEw7xzdGVyaMO2ZnQgKGR1ZXN0ZXJob2VmdEBnbXguZGUpIg==?=) Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 21:43:35 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost In-Reply-To: <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> Message-ID: <4B464777.1060303@gmx.de> gpvjem at sasktel.net wrote on Thu, 07 Jan 2010 13:35:55 -0600 > The "Route of the Pastor" check provided nothing new. John, the route at least suggestes that "Urwichwost" is somewhere near Oleszkowicze. A look at the according map from mapywig.org ("A45_B41_(XXVIII-19)_KIWERCE") shows multiple places in the vicinity beginning with "Ur." = Urwisko, thus maybe Urwichwost is a corrupted German version of one of these places, for instance of "Ur. Mosty" east of Oleszkowicze. Stefan D?sterh?ft From joepessarra at suddenlink.net Thu Jan 7 13:04:36 2010 From: joepessarra at suddenlink.net (joepessarra) Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2010 15:04:36 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost In-Reply-To: <4B464777.1060303@gmx.de> References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> <4B464777.1060303@gmx.de> Message-ID: <000001ca8fdd$04b3d840$0e1b88c0$@net> Harachwosty, Poland is only 42.5 miles west of Oleshkovice, Belarus. Joe in Texas -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of "Stefan D?sterh?ft (duesterhoeft at gmx.de)" Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 2:44 PM To: gpvjem Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost gpvjem at sasktel.net wrote on Thu, 07 Jan 2010 13:35:55 -0600 > The "Route of the Pastor" check provided nothing new. John, the route at least suggestes that "Urwichwost" is somewhere near Oleszkowicze. A look at the according map from mapywig.org ("A45_B41_(XXVIII-19)_KIWERCE") shows multiple places in the vicinity beginning with "Ur." = Urwisko, thus maybe Urwichwost is a corrupted German version of one of these places, for instance of "Ur. Mosty" east of Oleszkowicze. Stefan D?sterh?ft _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca Thu Jan 7 13:20:17 2010 From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca (Jerry Frank) Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 14:20:17 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost In-Reply-To: <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> Message-ID: Looking up the original record - There are 3 baptisms grouped together, taking place 28 May 1864 even though the births were back in 1863.? The 3, including the two from Ulwichwost (writing is very clear) took place at Rozyszcze.? I would therefore expect to see this village very nearby that location.? Joe's suggested location is almost certainly too far north.? Stefan's suggestions seem logical with a variety of villages to the east of Rozyszcze starting with the prefix Ul. (just as others start with Kol.).? I have not been able to see this village on any on line maps.? I have a few more hard copy resources at home and will check them when I get there.? Jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: gpvjem Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 12:40 pm Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Jerry: > ??? The date of birth of Christina Janke is > recorded as 14 Nov 1863.?? The "Route of the Pastor" > check provided nothing new. > > Leona Janke's sources included: > Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the > Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). > Maps of Volhynia > Library of Congress Maps: Poland:? G6520s, 100.P6 and > G7010s, 100.P6 > St Peterburg Volhynian records. > ?? > ???? It is entirely possible that Leona > Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg > Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a > legitimate spelling.?? On the other hand, why would > she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the > St Petersburg records? > > John > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > ? From: Jerry Frank > ? To: gpvjem > ? Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > ? Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM > > ? John, > > ? Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in > another message this morning? That will narrow down the search > even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a > variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what > time frame are we dealing with? > > > ? Jerry > > > > ? ----- Original Message ----- > ? From: gpvjem > ? Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am > ? Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > ? To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > > ? > > ? > Request assistance in determining the > ? > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called > Urichwost. > ? > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl > Seeker etc. > ? > with no results. Was there a possible name change? > ? > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat > ? > (county) but I don't know what township or tax > district. > ? > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative > which is > ? > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it > ? > was also noted with the same spelling in a very > comprehensive > ? > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of > AHSGR in > ? > 1998. She was not able to provide further information > ? > other than it was in Luck county. > ? > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. > ? > > ? > Thank you, > ? > John Marsch > ? > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From gary at warnerengineering.com Thu Jan 7 14:19:23 2010 From: gary at warnerengineering.com (Gary Warner) Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 14:19:23 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost In-Reply-To: <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> Message-ID: <4B465DEB.3030501@warnerengineering.com> John, Another clue to where this place may be near is to look at all of the other places where parents Wilhelm Janke and Wilhelmine Kuehn had children. Janke Michael 8 Sep 1866 "Sokulitz, Roschischtsche" Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmina Kuehn 1884089-1/1866 669 171 Sokulitz Janke Gottlieb 16 Oct 1867 Rozyszcze Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine Kuehn 1884092-2/1868 189 70 Janke Christina 14 Nov 1863 Urwichwost Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine Kuehn 1884124-2/1864 14 142 Kuehn Janke Justine 01 Feb 1872 Rudezka Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine Kuehn 1895621-1/1873 201 272 Janke Emilie 31 Mar 1885 Rozyszcze parish Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine Kuehn 1897692-1/1885 215 174 Janke Christian 26 Sep 1873 "Rudeska, Kr. Dubno" Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine Kuhn 1884065-2/1875 501 291 Janke August 16 Oct 1875 Rudctzki Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine Kuhn 1884069-2/1876 619 365 Janke Caroline 26 Jan 1879 Bronislaw Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine 1895627-2/1879 676 498 mother's last name not given Janke Louise 11 Mar 1887 Subilno Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine Kuehn 2380020/1887 46 370 The second to the last entry above may not be the correct family, since the mother's surname is not given. Also, here is the data if the surname is spelled Jahnke Jahnke Rosalie 13 Oct 1869 Gorodnitze Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine Kuehn 1884113-1/1870 422 106 Jahnke Ludwig 07 Jun 1883 Neu Seefeld or Zifeld Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine Kuehn 1895614-3/1883 590 581 Zifeld Gary On 1/7/2010 11:35 AM, gpvjem wrote: > Jerry: > The date of birth of Christina Janke is recorded as 14 Nov 1863. The "Route of the Pastor" check provided nothing new. > > Leona Janke's sources included: > Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). > Maps of Volhynia > Library of Congress Maps: Poland: G6520s, 100.P6 and G7010s, 100.P6 > St Peterburg Volhynian records. > > It is entirely possible that Leona Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a legitimate spelling. On the other hand, why would she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the St Petersburg records? > > John > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > From: Jerry Frank > To: gpvjem > Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM > > John, > > Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in another message this morning? That will narrow down the search even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what time frame are we dealing with? > > > Jerry > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: gpvjem > Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > > > > > Request assistance in determining the > > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called Urichwost. > > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl Seeker etc. > > with no results. Was there a possible name change? > > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat > > (county) but I don't know what township or tax district. > > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative which is > > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it > > was also noted with the same spelling in a very comprehensive > > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of AHSGR in > > 1998. She was not able to provide further information > > other than it was in Luck county. > > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. > > > > Thank you, > > John Marsch > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > From gary at warnerengineering.com Thu Jan 7 16:08:25 2010 From: gary at warnerengineering.com (Gary Warner) Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 16:08:25 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost In-Reply-To: References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> Message-ID: <4B467779.9070509@warnerengineering.com> To all, My German co-worker has suggested that the location noted by the pastor above the three grouped records is "Lethausn zu Rozyszcze". He thinks that perhaps there is a missing e and that the place is Lethausen. Gary On 1/7/2010 1:20 PM, Jerry Frank wrote: > Looking up the original record - There are 3 baptisms grouped together, taking place 28 May 1864 even though the births were back in 1863. The 3, including the two from Ulwichwost (writing is very clear) took place at Rozyszcze. I would therefore expect to see this village very nearby that location. > > Joe's suggested location is almost certainly too far north. Stefan's suggestions seem logical with a variety of villages to the east of Rozyszcze starting with the prefix Ul. (just as others start with Kol.). I have not been able to see this village on any on line maps. I have a few more hard copy resources at home and will check them when I get there. > > > Jerry > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: gpvjem > Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 12:40 pm > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > > >> Jerry: >> The date of birth of Christina Janke is >> recorded as 14 Nov 1863. The "Route of the Pastor" >> check provided nothing new. >> >> Leona Janke's sources included: >> Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the >> Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). >> Maps of Volhynia >> Library of Congress Maps: Poland: G6520s, 100.P6 and >> G7010s, 100.P6 >> St Peterburg Volhynian records. >> >> It is entirely possible that Leona >> Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg >> Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a >> legitimate spelling. On the other hand, why would >> she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the >> St Petersburg records? >> >> John >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------- >> >> From: Jerry Frank >> To: gpvjem >> Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM >> >> John, >> >> Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in >> another message this morning? That will narrow down the search >> even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a >> variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what >> time frame are we dealing with? >> >> >> Jerry >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: gpvjem >> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am >> Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >> >> > >> > Request assistance in determining the >> > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called >> Urichwost. >> > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl >> Seeker etc. >> > with no results. Was there a possible name change? >> > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat >> > (county) but I don't know what township or tax >> district. >> > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative >> which is >> > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it >> > was also noted with the same spelling in a very >> comprehensive >> > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of >> AHSGR in >> > 1998. She was not able to provide further information >> > other than it was in Luck county. >> > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. >> > >> > Thank you, >> > John Marsch >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > From perry1121 at aol.com Thu Jan 7 17:17:40 2010 From: perry1121 at aol.com (Sigrid Pohl Perry) Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 19:17:40 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost & "Lethausen" In-Reply-To: <4B467779.9070509@warnerengineering.com> References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> <4B467779.9070509@warnerengineering.com> Message-ID: <4B4687B4.5070906@aol.com> To all, I suggest that "Lethausen zu Rozyszcze" might be "Bethausen zu Rozyszcze" which would refer to the grouping of "chapels" which the pastor served in this region. I realize it seems hard to confuse the letters B and L but I actually saw a German record recently which had that mistake. Sigrid Pohl Perry On 1/7/2010 6:08 PM, Gary Warner wrote: > To all, > > My German co-worker has suggested that the location noted by the pastor > above the three grouped records is "Lethausn zu Rozyszcze". He thinks > that perhaps there is a missing e and that the place is Lethausen. > > Gary > > On 1/7/2010 1:20 PM, Jerry Frank wrote: > >> Looking up the original record - There are 3 baptisms grouped together, taking place 28 May 1864 even though the births were back in 1863. The 3, including the two from Ulwichwost (writing is very clear) took place at Rozyszcze. I would therefore expect to see this village very nearby that location. >> >> Joe's suggested location is almost certainly too far north. Stefan's suggestions seem logical with a variety of villages to the east of Rozyszcze starting with the prefix Ul. (just as others start with Kol.). I have not been able to see this village on any on line maps. I have a few more hard copy resources at home and will check them when I get there. >> >> >> Jerry >> >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: gpvjem >> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 12:40 pm >> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >> >> >> >>> Jerry: >>> The date of birth of Christina Janke is >>> recorded as 14 Nov 1863. The "Route of the Pastor" >>> check provided nothing new. >>> >>> Leona Janke's sources included: >>> Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the >>> Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). >>> Maps of Volhynia >>> Library of Congress Maps: Poland: G6520s, 100.P6 and >>> G7010s, 100.P6 >>> St Peterburg Volhynian records. >>> >>> It is entirely possible that Leona >>> Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg >>> Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a >>> legitimate spelling. On the other hand, why would >>> she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the >>> St Petersburg records? >>> >>> John >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> From: Jerry Frank >>> To: gpvjem >>> Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM >>> >>> John, >>> >>> Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in >>> another message this morning? That will narrow down the search >>> even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a >>> variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what >>> time frame are we dealing with? >>> >>> >>> Jerry >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: gpvjem >>> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am >>> Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >>> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>> >>> > >>> > Request assistance in determining the >>> > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called >>> Urichwost. >>> > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl >>> Seeker etc. >>> > with no results. Was there a possible name change? >>> > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat >>> > (county) but I don't know what township or tax >>> district. >>> > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative >>> which is >>> > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it >>> > was also noted with the same spelling in a very >>> comprehensive >>> > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of >>> AHSGR in >>> > 1998. She was not able to provide further information >>> > other than it was in Luck county. >>> > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. >>> > >>> > Thank you, >>> > John Marsch >>> > >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >>> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >>> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca Thu Jan 7 17:55:32 2010 From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca (Jerry Frank) Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 18:55:32 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost In-Reply-To: <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> Message-ID: <4B469094.1060902@shaw.ca> I have searched all my hard copy maps as well and have come up with a blank on this place name. Either the location was short-lived or the name changed to something else. I've noticed that Leona's listing for Urwichwost makes a side reference to Ypba but I could not find anything like that either. Jerry Frank Calgary, AB gpvjem wrote: > Jerry: > The date of birth of Christina Janke is recorded as 14 Nov 1863. The "Route of the Pastor" check provided nothing new. > > Leona Janke's sources included: > Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). > Maps of Volhynia > Library of Congress Maps: Poland: G6520s, 100.P6 and G7010s, 100.P6 > St Peterburg Volhynian records. > > It is entirely possible that Leona Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a legitimate spelling. On the other hand, why would she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the St Petersburg records? > > John > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > From: Jerry Frank > To: gpvjem > Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM > > John, > > Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in another message this morning? That will narrow down the search even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what time frame are we dealing with? > > > Jerry > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: gpvjem > Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > > > > > Request assistance in determining the > > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called Urichwost. > > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl Seeker etc. > > with no results. Was there a possible name change? > > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat > > (county) but I don't know what township or tax district. > > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative which is > > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it > > was also noted with the same spelling in a very comprehensive > > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of AHSGR in > > 1998. She was not able to provide further information > > other than it was in Luck county. > > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. > > > > Thank you, > > John Marsch > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > From roseingram at shaw.ca Thu Jan 7 18:32:13 2010 From: roseingram at shaw.ca (Rose Ingram) Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2010 18:32:13 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost & "Lethausen" References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> <4B467779.9070509@warnerengineering.com> <4B4687B4.5070906@aol.com> Message-ID: <016d01ca900a$c97f5b40$6601a8c0@duocore> I've looked at the page from the church book. It is written bethause zu Rozyszcze. Rose Ingram ----- Original Message ----- From: Sigrid Pohl Perry To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 5:17 PM Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost & "Lethausen" To all, I suggest that "Lethausen zu Rozyszcze" might be "Bethausen zu Rozyszcze" which would refer to the grouping of "chapels" which the pastor served in this region. I realize it seems hard to confuse the letters B and L but I actually saw a German record recently which had that mistake. Sigrid Pohl Perry On 1/7/2010 6:08 PM, Gary Warner wrote: > To all, > > My German co-worker has suggested that the location noted by the pastor > above the three grouped records is "Lethausn zu Rozyszcze". He thinks > that perhaps there is a missing e and that the place is Lethausen. > > Gary > > On 1/7/2010 1:20 PM, Jerry Frank wrote: > >> Looking up the original record - There are 3 baptisms grouped together, taking place 28 May 1864 even though the births were back in 1863. The 3, including the two from Ulwichwost (writing is very clear) took place at Rozyszcze. I would therefore expect to see this village very nearby that location. >> >> Joe's suggested location is almost certainly too far north. Stefan's suggestions seem logical with a variety of villages to the east of Rozyszcze starting with the prefix Ul. (just as others start with Kol.). I have not been able to see this village on any on line maps. I have a few more hard copy resources at home and will check them when I get there. >> >> >> Jerry >> >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: gpvjem >> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 12:40 pm >> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >> >> >> >>> Jerry: >>> The date of birth of Christina Janke is >>> recorded as 14 Nov 1863. The "Route of the Pastor" >>> check provided nothing new. >>> >>> Leona Janke's sources included: >>> Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the >>> Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). >>> Maps of Volhynia >>> Library of Congress Maps: Poland: G6520s, 100.P6 and >>> G7010s, 100.P6 >>> St Peterburg Volhynian records. >>> >>> It is entirely possible that Leona >>> Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg >>> Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a >>> legitimate spelling. On the other hand, why would >>> she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the >>> St Petersburg records? >>> >>> John >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> From: Jerry Frank >>> To: gpvjem >>> Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM >>> >>> John, >>> >>> Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in >>> another message this morning? That will narrow down the search >>> even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a >>> variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what >>> time frame are we dealing with? >>> >>> >>> Jerry >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: gpvjem >>> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am >>> Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >>> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>> >>> > >>> > Request assistance in determining the >>> > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called >>> Urichwost. >>> > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl >>> Seeker etc. >>> > with no results. Was there a possible name change? >>> > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat >>> > (county) but I don't know what township or tax >>> district. >>> > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative >>> which is >>> > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it >>> > was also noted with the same spelling in a very >>> comprehensive >>> > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of >>> AHSGR in >>> > 1998. She was not able to provide further information >>> > other than it was in Luck county. >>> > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. >>> > >>> > Thank you, >>> > John Marsch >>> > >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >>> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >>> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From eduardo.kommers at gmail.com Fri Jan 8 03:41:50 2010 From: eduardo.kommers at gmail.com (Eduardo Kommers) Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2010 09:41:50 -0200 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Radke References: <6A5ACE7A84DD406BB17E48283B15752C@winxppro> Message-ID: <00a001ca9057$93e1e550$0301010a@ntbrt02> Linda, just for your info... there is a Johan Heinrich RATKE arrived in Brazil in 1890, with his wife Carolina. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Holewa" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2010 12:30 PM Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Radke > Hi > I am looking for the descendants of George Radke who married Christina > Kreuken and he remarried Wilhelmine Krinke.. > I am looking for more informations on his one of children, Michael Radke > who married Florentina Silk. > Regards > Linda > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From gpvjem at sasktel.net Fri Jan 8 06:13:09 2010 From: gpvjem at sasktel.net (gpvjem) Date: Fri, 08 Jan 2010 08:13:09 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost Message-ID: My sincere thank you to all that responded to my request of assistance regarding the place name Urichwost. Not only was my question solved, but I also learned that a little more diligent research on my part would have been in order. 8>) I am a charter member of SGGEE and a very early subscriber to our Listserve, nevertheless I am still amazed and impressed at the knowledge evident and the willingness of fellow members of both to go "the extra mile" in providing solutions to questions throughout these past 12 years. Again, thank you, John Marsch From LINDASUSAK at comcast.net Fri Jan 8 07:08:42 2010 From: LINDASUSAK at comcast.net (LINDASUSAK@comcast.net) Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2010 15:08:42 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost In-Reply-To: <4B469094.1060902@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <760310637.7555581262963322291.JavaMail.root@sz0079a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Actually, in old Gothic German script, the L and B are very similar., in reference to Lethausen or Bethausen. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Frank" To: "gpvjem" Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Thursday, January 7, 2010 6:55:32 PM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost I have searched all my hard copy maps as well and have come up with a blank on this place name. Either the location was short-lived or the name changed to something else. I've noticed that Leona's listing for Urwichwost makes a side reference to Ypba but I could not find anything like that either. Jerry Frank Calgary, AB gpvjem wrote: > Jerry: > The date of birth of Christina Janke is recorded as 14 Nov 1863. The "Route of the Pastor" check provided nothing new. > > Leona Janke's sources included: > Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). > Maps of Volhynia > Library of Congress Maps: Poland: G6520s, 100.P6 and G7010s, 100.P6 > St Peterburg Volhynian records. > > It is entirely possible that Leona Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a legitimate spelling. On the other hand, why would she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the St Petersburg records? > > John > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > From: Jerry Frank > To: gpvjem > Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM > > John, > > Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in another message this morning? That will narrow down the search even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what time frame are we dealing with? > > > Jerry > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: gpvjem > Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > > > > > Request assistance in determining the > > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called Urichwost. > > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl Seeker etc. > > with no results. Was there a possible name change? > > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat > > (county) but I don't know what township or tax district. > > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative which is > > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it > > was also noted with the same spelling in a very comprehensive > > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of AHSGR in > > 1998. She was not able to provide further information > > other than it was in Luck county. > > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. > > > > Thank you, > > John Marsch > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From gary at warnerengineering.com Fri Jan 8 08:59:09 2010 From: gary at warnerengineering.com (Gary Warner) Date: Fri, 08 Jan 2010 08:59:09 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost & "Lethausen" In-Reply-To: <4B4687B4.5070906@aol.com> References: <54480DD67A564E08A1197232E210CC7D@Marsh> <709265B85693454C8BFD83D828D94EE7@Marsh> <4B467779.9070509@warnerengineering.com> <4B4687B4.5070906@aol.com> Message-ID: <4B47645D.4050500@warnerengineering.com> To all, Well, at least I did own up to the fact that my German was not good. Several of you have corrected my post to note that the pastor was talking about the Bethaus (chapel) in Rozyszcze. I am not regretful about posting something that was not correct, as I knew several of you would be ready to make it right. Thanks to all. Gary On 1/7/2010 5:17 PM, Sigrid Pohl Perry wrote: > To all, > > I suggest that "Lethausen zu Rozyszcze" might be "Bethausen zu > Rozyszcze" which would refer to the grouping of "chapels" which the > pastor served in this region. I realize it seems hard to confuse the > letters B and L but I actually saw a German record recently which had > that mistake. > > Sigrid Pohl Perry > > On 1/7/2010 6:08 PM, Gary Warner wrote: > >> To all, >> >> My German co-worker has suggested that the location noted by the pastor >> above the three grouped records is "Lethausn zu Rozyszcze". He thinks >> that perhaps there is a missing e and that the place is Lethausen. >> >> Gary >> >> On 1/7/2010 1:20 PM, Jerry Frank wrote: >> >> >>> Looking up the original record - There are 3 baptisms grouped together, taking place 28 May 1864 even though the births were back in 1863. The 3, including the two from Ulwichwost (writing is very clear) took place at Rozyszcze. I would therefore expect to see this village very nearby that location. >>> >>> Joe's suggested location is almost certainly too far north. Stefan's suggestions seem logical with a variety of villages to the east of Rozyszcze starting with the prefix Ul. (just as others start with Kol.). I have not been able to see this village on any on line maps. I have a few more hard copy resources at home and will check them when I get there. >>> >>> >>> Jerry >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: gpvjem >>> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 12:40 pm >>> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >>> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> Jerry: >>>> The date of birth of Christina Janke is >>>> recorded as 14 Nov 1863. The "Route of the Pastor" >>>> check provided nothing new. >>>> >>>> Leona Janke's sources included: >>>> Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the >>>> Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). >>>> Maps of Volhynia >>>> Library of Congress Maps: Poland: G6520s, 100.P6 and >>>> G7010s, 100.P6 >>>> St Peterburg Volhynian records. >>>> >>>> It is entirely possible that Leona >>>> Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg >>>> Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a >>>> legitimate spelling. On the other hand, why would >>>> she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the >>>> St Petersburg records? >>>> >>>> John >>>> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> From: Jerry Frank >>>> To: gpvjem >>>> Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>>> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM >>>> >>>> John, >>>> >>>> Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in >>>> another message this morning? That will narrow down the search >>>> even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a >>>> variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what >>>> time frame are we dealing with? >>>> >>>> >>>> Jerry >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: gpvjem >>>> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am >>>> Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >>>> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>>> >>>> > >>>> > Request assistance in determining the >>>> > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called >>>> Urichwost. >>>> > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl >>>> Seeker etc. >>>> > with no results. Was there a possible name change? >>>> > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat >>>> > (county) but I don't know what township or tax >>>> district. >>>> > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative >>>> which is >>>> > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it >>>> > was also noted with the same spelling in a very >>>> comprehensive >>>> > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of >>>> AHSGR in >>>> > 1998. She was not able to provide further information >>>> > other than it was in Luck county. >>>> > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. >>>> > >>>> > Thank you, >>>> > John Marsch >>>> > >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >>>> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >>>> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >>> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >>> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >>> >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From ya895 at victoria.tc.ca Fri Jan 8 09:50:30 2010 From: ya895 at victoria.tc.ca (Evert Moes) Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2010 09:50:30 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Bethausen References: Message-ID: <0C37A6ADAD27494C83F5D9EA9FEA8B65@xphome> Just as clarification: It is quite easy to confuse the letters L and B in German gothic script, and someone not totally familiar could very easily transcribe the capital letters B and the L ! Evert in Sidney, B.C. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 5:18 PM Subject: Ger-Poland-Volhynia Digest, Vol 80, Issue 6 > Send Ger-Poland-Volhynia mailing list submissions to > ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://eclipse.sggee.org/mailman/listinfo/ger-poland-volhynia > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > ger-poland-volhynia-request at eclipse.sggee.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > ger-poland-volhynia-owner at eclipse.sggee.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Ger-Poland-Volhynia digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Place Name Urichwost (joepessarra) > 2. Re: Place Name Urichwost (Stefan D?sterh?ft (duesterhoeft at gmx.de)) > 3. Re: Place Name Urichwost (joepessarra) > 4. Re: Place Name Urichwost (Jerry Frank) > 5. Re: Place Name Urichwost (Gary Warner) > 6. Re: Place Name Urichwost (Gary Warner) > 7. Re: Place Name Urichwost & "Lethausen" (Sigrid Pohl Perry) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2010 14:06:34 -0600 > From: "joepessarra" > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: > Message-ID: <000901ca8fd4$e93e8db0$bbbba910$@net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Just a possibility: > > Luck, Poland is at 51 26 N, 22 39 E, and Harachwosty is only 46.3 miles N > of > Luck. > > Joe in Texas > > -----Original Message----- > From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org > [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Jerry > Frank > Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM > To: gpvjem > Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > > John, > > Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in another message > this morning?? That will narrow down the search even more than "Luck > Powiat" > and will allow us to browse a variety of maps we have to see if it can be > found.? Also, what time frame are we dealing with? > > > Jerry > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: gpvjem > Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > >> ??? >> ??? Request assistance in determining the >> location and fate of a place in Volhynia called Urichwost.? >> I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl Seeker etc. >> with no results.? Was there a possible name change? >> ??? Apparently it was located in Luck powiat >> (county) but I don't know what township or tax district.? >> Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative which is >> recorded on LDS film 1,884,124? Registration #142 and it >> was also noted with the same spelling in a very comprehensive >> Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of AHSGR in >> 1998.? She was not able to provide further information >> other than it was in Luck county. >> ??? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. >> >> Thank you, >> John Marsch >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 21:43:35 +0100 > From: "Stefan D?sterh?ft (duesterhoeft at gmx.de)" > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: gpvjem > Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Message-ID: <4B464777.1060303 at gmx.de> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > gpvjem at sasktel.net wrote on Thu, 07 Jan 2010 13:35:55 -0600 > >> The "Route of the Pastor" check provided nothing new. > > John, > > the route at least suggestes that "Urwichwost" is somewhere near > Oleszkowicze. A look at the according map from mapywig.org > ("A45_B41_(XXVIII-19)_KIWERCE") shows multiple places in the vicinity > beginning with "Ur." = Urwisko, thus maybe Urwichwost is a corrupted > German version of one of these places, for instance of "Ur. Mosty" east > of Oleszkowicze. > > Stefan D?sterh?ft > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2010 15:04:36 -0600 > From: "joepessarra" > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: > Message-ID: <000001ca8fdd$04b3d840$0e1b88c0$@net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > Harachwosty, Poland is only 42.5 miles west of Oleshkovice, Belarus. > > Joe in Texas > > -----Original Message----- > From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org > [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of > "Stefan D?sterh?ft (duesterhoeft at gmx.de)" > Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 2:44 PM > To: gpvjem > Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > > gpvjem at sasktel.net wrote on Thu, 07 Jan 2010 13:35:55 -0600 > >> The "Route of the Pastor" check provided nothing new. > > John, > > the route at least suggestes that "Urwichwost" is somewhere near > Oleszkowicze. A look at the according map from mapywig.org > ("A45_B41_(XXVIII-19)_KIWERCE") shows multiple places in the vicinity > beginning with "Ur." = Urwisko, thus maybe Urwichwost is a corrupted > German version of one of these places, for instance of "Ur. Mosty" east > of Oleszkowicze. > > Stefan D?sterh?ft > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 14:20:17 -0700 > From: Jerry Frank > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: gpvjem > Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 > > Looking up the original record - There are 3 baptisms grouped together, > taking place 28 May 1864 even though the births were back in 1863.? The 3, > including the two from Ulwichwost (writing is very clear) took place at > Rozyszcze.? I would therefore expect to see this village very nearby that > location.? > > Joe's suggested location is almost certainly too far north.? Stefan's > suggestions seem logical with a variety of villages to the east of > Rozyszcze starting with the prefix Ul. (just as others start with Kol.).? > I have not been able to see this village on any on line maps.? I have a > few more hard copy resources at home and will check them when I get > there.? > > > Jerry > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: gpvjem > Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 12:40 pm > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > >> Jerry: >> ??? The date of birth of Christina Janke is >> recorded as 14 Nov 1863.?? The "Route of the Pastor" >> check provided nothing new. >> >> Leona Janke's sources included: >> Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the >> Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). >> Maps of Volhynia >> Library of Congress Maps: Poland:? G6520s, 100.P6 and >> G7010s, 100.P6 >> St Peterburg Volhynian records. >> ?? >> ???? It is entirely possible that Leona >> Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg >> Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a >> legitimate spelling.?? On the other hand, why would >> she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the >> St Petersburg records? >> >> John >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------- >> >> ? From: Jerry Frank >> ? To: gpvjem >> ? Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >> ? Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM >> >> ? John, >> >> ? Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in >> another message this morning? That will narrow down the search >> even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a >> variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what >> time frame are we dealing with? >> >> >> ? Jerry >> >> >> >> ? ----- Original Message ----- >> ? From: gpvjem >> ? Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am >> ? Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >> ? To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >> >> ? > >> ? > Request assistance in determining the >> ? > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called >> Urichwost. >> ? > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl >> Seeker etc. >> ? > with no results. Was there a possible name change? >> ? > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat >> ? > (county) but I don't know what township or tax >> district. >> ? > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative >> which is >> ? > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it >> ? > was also noted with the same spelling in a very >> comprehensive >> ? > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of >> AHSGR in >> ? > 1998. She was not able to provide further information >> ? > other than it was in Luck county. >> ? > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. >> ? > >> ? > Thank you, >> ? > John Marsch >> ? > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 14:19:23 -0800 > From: Gary Warner > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: gpvjem > Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Message-ID: <4B465DEB.3030501 at warnerengineering.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > John, > > Another clue to where this place may be near is to look at all of the > other places where parents Wilhelm Janke and Wilhelmine Kuehn had > children. > > Janke Michael 8 Sep 1866 "Sokulitz, Roschischtsche" Rozyszcze > Wilhelm Wilhelmina Kuehn 1884089-1/1866 669 171 Sokulitz > Janke Gottlieb 16 Oct 1867 Rozyszcze Rozyszcze Wilhelm > Wilhelmine Kuehn 1884092-2/1868 189 70 > Janke Christina 14 Nov 1863 Urwichwost Rozyszcze Wilhelm > Wilhelmine Kuehn 1884124-2/1864 14 142 Kuehn > Janke Justine 01 Feb 1872 Rudezka Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine > Kuehn 1895621-1/1873 201 272 > Janke Emilie 31 Mar 1885 Rozyszcze parish Rozyszcze Wilhelm > Wilhelmine Kuehn 1897692-1/1885 215 174 > Janke Christian 26 Sep 1873 "Rudeska, Kr. Dubno" Rozyszcze > Wilhelm Wilhelmine Kuhn 1884065-2/1875 501 291 > Janke August 16 Oct 1875 Rudctzki Rozyszcze Wilhelm > Wilhelmine Kuhn 1884069-2/1876 619 365 > Janke Caroline 26 Jan 1879 Bronislaw Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine > 1895627-2/1879 676 498 mother's last name not given > Janke Louise 11 Mar 1887 Subilno Rozyszcze Wilhelm Wilhelmine > Kuehn 2380020/1887 46 370 > > > The second to the last entry above may not be the correct family, since > the mother's surname is not given. > > Also, here is the data if the surname is spelled Jahnke > > Jahnke Rosalie 13 Oct 1869 Gorodnitze Rozyszcze Wilhelm > Wilhelmine Kuehn 1884113-1/1870 422 106 > Jahnke Ludwig 07 Jun 1883 Neu Seefeld or Zifeld Rozyszcze > Wilhelm Wilhelmine Kuehn 1895614-3/1883 590 581 Zifeld > > > Gary > > > > On 1/7/2010 11:35 AM, gpvjem wrote: >> Jerry: >> The date of birth of Christina Janke is recorded as 14 Nov 1863. >> The "Route of the Pastor" check provided nothing new. >> >> Leona Janke's sources included: >> Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the Polish >> Republic (Years 1933-34). >> Maps of Volhynia >> Library of Congress Maps: Poland: G6520s, 100.P6 and G7010s, 100.P6 >> St Peterburg Volhynian records. >> >> It is entirely possible that Leona Janke picked up the place name >> Urichwost from the St Petersburg Volhynian records just as I did, and >> that it may not be a legitimate spelling. On the other hand, why would >> she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the St >> Petersburg records? >> >> John >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------- >> >> From: Jerry Frank >> To: gpvjem >> Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM >> >> John, >> >> Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in another >> message this morning? That will narrow down the search even more than >> "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a variety of maps we have to >> see if it can be found. Also, what time frame are we dealing with? >> >> >> Jerry >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: gpvjem >> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am >> Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >> >> > >> > Request assistance in determining the >> > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called Urichwost. >> > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl Seeker etc. >> > with no results. Was there a possible name change? >> > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat >> > (county) but I don't know what township or tax district. >> > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative which is >> > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it >> > was also noted with the same spelling in a very comprehensive >> > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of AHSGR in >> > 1998. She was not able to provide further information >> > other than it was in Luck county. >> > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. >> > >> > Thank you, >> > John Marsch >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> >> > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 16:08:25 -0800 > From: Gary Warner > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost > To: Jerry Frank > Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org, gpvjem > Message-ID: <4B467779.9070509 at warnerengineering.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > To all, > > My German co-worker has suggested that the location noted by the pastor > above the three grouped records is "Lethausn zu Rozyszcze". He thinks > that perhaps there is a missing e and that the place is Lethausen. > > Gary > > On 1/7/2010 1:20 PM, Jerry Frank wrote: >> Looking up the original record - There are 3 baptisms grouped together, >> taking place 28 May 1864 even though the births were back in 1863. The >> 3, including the two from Ulwichwost (writing is very clear) took place >> at Rozyszcze. I would therefore expect to see this village very nearby >> that location. >> >> Joe's suggested location is almost certainly too far north. Stefan's >> suggestions seem logical with a variety of villages to the east of >> Rozyszcze starting with the prefix Ul. (just as others start with Kol.). >> I have not been able to see this village on any on line maps. I have a >> few more hard copy resources at home and will check them when I get >> there. >> >> >> Jerry >> >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: gpvjem >> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 12:40 pm >> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >> >> >>> Jerry: >>> The date of birth of Christina Janke is >>> recorded as 14 Nov 1863. The "Route of the Pastor" >>> check provided nothing new. >>> >>> Leona Janke's sources included: >>> Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the >>> Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). >>> Maps of Volhynia >>> Library of Congress Maps: Poland: G6520s, 100.P6 and >>> G7010s, 100.P6 >>> St Peterburg Volhynian records. >>> >>> It is entirely possible that Leona >>> Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg >>> Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a >>> legitimate spelling. On the other hand, why would >>> she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the >>> St Petersburg records? >>> >>> John >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> From: Jerry Frank >>> To: gpvjem >>> Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM >>> >>> John, >>> >>> Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in >>> another message this morning? That will narrow down the search >>> even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a >>> variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what >>> time frame are we dealing with? >>> >>> >>> Jerry >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: gpvjem >>> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am >>> Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >>> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>> >>> > >>> > Request assistance in determining the >>> > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called >>> Urichwost. >>> > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl >>> Seeker etc. >>> > with no results. Was there a possible name change? >>> > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat >>> > (county) but I don't know what township or tax >>> district. >>> > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative >>> which is >>> > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it >>> > was also noted with the same spelling in a very >>> comprehensive >>> > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of >>> AHSGR in >>> > 1998. She was not able to provide further information >>> > other than it was in Luck county. >>> > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. >>> > >>> > Thank you, >>> > John Marsch >>> > >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >>> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >>> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> >> > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2010 19:17:40 -0600 > From: Sigrid Pohl Perry > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost & "Lethausen" > To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Message-ID: <4B4687B4.5070906 at aol.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > To all, > > I suggest that "Lethausen zu Rozyszcze" might be "Bethausen zu > Rozyszcze" which would refer to the grouping of "chapels" which the > pastor served in this region. I realize it seems hard to confuse the > letters B and L but I actually saw a German record recently which had > that mistake. > > Sigrid Pohl Perry > > On 1/7/2010 6:08 PM, Gary Warner wrote: >> To all, >> >> My German co-worker has suggested that the location noted by the pastor >> above the three grouped records is "Lethausn zu Rozyszcze". He thinks >> that perhaps there is a missing e and that the place is Lethausen. >> >> Gary >> >> On 1/7/2010 1:20 PM, Jerry Frank wrote: >> >>> Looking up the original record - There are 3 baptisms grouped together, >>> taking place 28 May 1864 even though the births were back in 1863. The >>> 3, including the two from Ulwichwost (writing is very clear) took place >>> at Rozyszcze. I would therefore expect to see this village very nearby >>> that location. >>> >>> Joe's suggested location is almost certainly too far north. Stefan's >>> suggestions seem logical with a variety of villages to the east of >>> Rozyszcze starting with the prefix Ul. (just as others start with Kol.). >>> I have not been able to see this village on any on line maps. I have a >>> few more hard copy resources at home and will check them when I get >>> there. >>> >>> >>> Jerry >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: gpvjem >>> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 12:40 pm >>> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >>> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>> >>> >>> >>>> Jerry: >>>> The date of birth of Christina Janke is >>>> recorded as 14 Nov 1863. The "Route of the Pastor" >>>> check provided nothing new. >>>> >>>> Leona Janke's sources included: >>>> Gazetteer: Tadeusz Bystrzycki's Reference to Places in the >>>> Polish Republic (Years 1933-34). >>>> Maps of Volhynia >>>> Library of Congress Maps: Poland: G6520s, 100.P6 and >>>> G7010s, 100.P6 >>>> St Peterburg Volhynian records. >>>> >>>> It is entirely possible that Leona >>>> Janke picked up the place name Urichwost from the St Petersburg >>>> Volhynian records just as I did, and that it may not be a >>>> legitimate spelling. On the other hand, why would >>>> she say it was in Luck county because it doesn't say that on the >>>> St Petersburg records? >>>> >>>> John >>>> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> From: Jerry Frank >>>> To: gpvjem >>>> Cc: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>>> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 11:19 AM >>>> >>>> John, >>>> >>>> Can you do a "Route of the Pastor" check as described in >>>> another message this morning? That will narrow down the search >>>> even more than "Luck Powiat" and will allow us to browse a >>>> variety of maps we have to see if it can be found. Also, what >>>> time frame are we dealing with? >>>> >>>> >>>> Jerry >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: gpvjem >>>> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010 9:32 am >>>> Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Place Name Urichwost >>>> To: Ger-Poland-Volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org >>>> >>>> > >>>> > Request assistance in determining the >>>> > location and fate of a place in Volhynia called >>>> Urichwost. >>>> > I have checked out the usual sources such as Stetl >>>> Seeker etc. >>>> > with no results. Was there a possible name change? >>>> > Apparently it was located in Luck powiat >>>> > (county) but I don't know what township or tax >>>> district. >>>> > Urichwost was the birth place of a distant relative >>>> which is >>>> > recorded on LDS film 1,884,124 Registration #142 and it >>>> > was also noted with the same spelling in a very >>>> comprehensive >>>> > Volhynian place name list compiled by Leona Janke of >>>> AHSGR in >>>> > 1998. She was not able to provide further information >>>> > other than it was in Luck county. >>>> > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. >>>> > >>>> > Thank you, >>>> > John Marsch >>>> > >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >>>> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >>>> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >>> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >>> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia mailing list, hosted by the: > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv.html > > > End of Ger-Poland-Volhynia Digest, Vol 80, Issue 6 > ************************************************** > From rdnatzke at charter.net Fri Jan 8 20:57:32 2010 From: rdnatzke at charter.net (Royal Natzke) Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2010 22:57:32 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Radke References: <6A5ACE7A84DD406BB17E48283B15752C@winxppro> <00a001ca9057$93e1e550$0301010a@ntbrt02> Message-ID: I have a Friedrich Ludwig and Christian Rathke who came from Dargislaff, Kreis Greifenberg, Pomerania in 1862 to Grafton, WI, just north of Milwaukee. Do you know where your Johann Friedrich was born? Royal Natzke ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eduardo Kommers" To: "Linda Holewa" ; Sent: Friday, January 08, 2010 5:41 AM Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Radke > Linda, just for your info... there is a Johan Heinrich RATKE arrived in > Brazil in 1890, with his wife Carolina. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Linda Holewa" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2010 12:30 PM > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Radke > > >> Hi >> I am looking for the descendants of George Radke who married Christina >> Kreuken and he remarried Wilhelmine Krinke.. >> I am looking for more informations on his one of children, Michael Radke >> who married Florentina Silk. >> Regards >> Linda >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From krampetz at aol.com Sat Jan 9 19:36:10 2010 From: krampetz at aol.com (krampetz@aol.com) Date: Sat, 9 Jan 2010 22:36:10 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Looking for Richard Stephan, was RSTEP@QTM.NET Message-ID: <17b8e.fae8b8c.387aa52a@aol.com> He was an SGGEE member in 2002, if you have his new ID? Thanks, Bob K. From dproper at charter.net Sun Jan 10 20:04:34 2010 From: dproper at charter.net (Dave Proper) Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2010 20:04:34 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Volhynia place names In-Reply-To: <4B45EC36.8000808@shaw.ca> Message-ID: Jerry, Thanks for the tip! I finally had time to sit down and give this a try. The "Pastor's path" showed the next village to be Glueckstal so I can feel confident that my initial section Bolarka #4 (the closest of the six) is most likely the correct one. Dave Proper _____ From: Jerry Frank [mailto:FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca] Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 6:14 AM To: Dave Proper Cc: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Volhynia place names Dave, Probably the best way to figure this out is by using our "Route of the Pastor" search function at http://www.sggee.org/members/StPeteByRoute (Members Only). The pastor would travel from village to village collecting info from the local Kantor. These villages would be in close proximity to each other. By looking at which villages were visited in sequence, and then looking on the map for that grouping, you will probably be able to figure out which is the correct Bolarka. Jerry Frank Calgary, AB Dave Proper wrote: Hi All, I have started the process of standardizing my Polish and Volhynian place names according to the new SGGEE Guidelines for places. Thus far I have done the easy ones and now am getting to the last few that are much harder to resolve. My current quandary is the all-to-common multiple place names that can exist with in a very small area. Case-in-point: I have a Gustave Adolph Kugler, b. 29 Oct 1871. Before it was easy - he was simply born in Bolarka, Volhynia (from the St Petersburg Consistory records). Now the gazetteer for Volhynia presents me with six choices to nail down the specific location: 1)Bolarka (Bialogrodka/Bilohorodka), Dubno, Rivne, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 501837 253247 2)Bolarka (Sosnowa-Bolarka/Vesnianka), Chervonoarmiisk, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 503411 281616 3)Bolarka-Radecka (Radziecka-Bolarka/Radetska Boliarka), Chervonoarmiisk, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 503524 281513 4)Boljarka (Balarka/Boliarka), Novohrad-Volynskyi, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 503030 274530 5)Boljarka (Bolarka Stara/Boliarka), Zhytomyr, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 501938 282127 6)Boljarka (Bolarka-Prosiecka/Boliarka), Yemilchyne, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 505100 273900 My first thought was "where were his siblings born?" An older brother, a younger sister and two younger brothers were all born in Glueckstal (all from the St Petes records). So which of the Bolarka's is the closest to Glueckstal and most likely of the six? That results in a list like this: #4 - 29 km #5 - 42 km #2 - 50 km #3 - 51 km #6 - 67 km #1 - 171 km So now I am leaning towards #4 but still looking for something further to tie it to that place. I looked at the Volhynian parish formation list http://www.sggee.org/research/parishes/parish_histories/VolhynianParishesDia gram.pdf and in the year 1871 there were four parishes - Shitomir, Kiev, Rozyszcze and Heimtal so that doesn't seem to provide and any further refinement. Without any further information a reasonable person would opt for Bolarka #4. Does anyone have further insight as to how to make the selection? Or should the option at the bottom of page 8 of the guidelines be used - Bolarka (many found),,,Poland? Dave Proper p/s Thanks to Frank Stewner and the others who put in countless hours creating these wonderfull new research tools! _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From GPVListAdmin at sggee.org Mon Jan 11 06:26:40 2010 From: GPVListAdmin at sggee.org (Jerry Frank) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 07:26:40 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region Message-ID: <4B4B3520.7070307@sggee.org> The following message was posted from Germany. The poster is not a subscriber so please respond personally if you can help. His email address is: roland.hertes at t-online.de Hello, My family lived in Poland around 1800 to 1845 in the region of Plock. One of the HERTES families migrated from Poland to the USA and Canada. I seek information about the following families. Buchholtz Ferchau Hertes Richert With friendly greetings, Roland Hertes ---------------------------------------------------- Hallo, meine Familie war von etwa 1800 - 1945 in Polen wohnhaft, und zwar haupts?chlich im Raum Plock. Einige Angeh?rige der Familie HERTES sind von Polen aus nach USA und Canada ausgewandert. Ich suche Informationen ?ber folgende Familien: BUCHHOLTZ FERCHAU, HERTES RICHERT Mit freundlichen Gr??en Roland (Hertes) From gary at warnerengineering.com Mon Jan 11 08:32:53 2010 From: gary at warnerengineering.com (Gary Warner) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 08:32:53 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region In-Reply-To: <4B4B3520.7070307@sggee.org> References: <4B4B3520.7070307@sggee.org> Message-ID: <4B4B52B5.4050305@warnerengineering.com> To all, We have the Heinrich Johann Hertes family from Plock in our Master Pedigree database. Three of the children marry into Fercho, and Richert families. Since this data is also in the SGGEE001 file, I expect that the records that we have are more numerous than just this one family. I will contact Roland separately. Gary Warner On 1/11/2010 6:26 AM, Jerry Frank wrote: > The following message was posted from Germany. The poster is not a > subscriber so please respond personally if you can help. His email > address is: > > roland.hertes at t-online.de > > Hello, > > My family lived in Poland around 1800 to 1845 in the region of Plock. > One of the HERTES families migrated from Poland to the USA and Canada. > I seek information about the following families. > > Buchholtz > Ferchau > Hertes > Richert > > With friendly greetings, > > Roland Hertes > > ---------------------------------------------------- > > > Hallo, > > meine Familie war von etwa 1800 - 1945 in Polen wohnhaft, und zwar > haupts?chlich im Raum Plock. > Einige Angeh?rige der Familie HERTES sind von Polen aus nach USA und > Canada ausgewandert. > > Ich suche Informationen ?ber folgende Familien: > > BUCHHOLTZ > FERCHAU, > HERTES > RICHERT > > Mit freundlichen Gr??en > Roland (Hertes) > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > From siegfried at familie-friedrich.de Mon Jan 11 11:15:10 2010 From: siegfried at familie-friedrich.de (Siegfried Friedrich) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 20:15:10 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region In-Reply-To: <4B4B52B5.4050305@warnerengineering.com> References: <4B4B3520.7070307@sggee.org> <4B4B52B5.4050305@warnerengineering.com> Message-ID: <4B4B78BE.8030205@familie-friedrich.de> Hello Roland, I've found the village chronicle of Nowe Boryszewo (Tiefenbach), Plock, from Franz Lackner. Here you can read something about the people, which settled in 1824 and lived there since 1945. for example: BUCHHOLTZ und FERCHAU. I found it, because I search for FRIEDRICH. I'm further interested. http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/VillageChronicles.htm http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/LacknerChronik.pdf http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/NoweBoryszewo_D.htm Best regards Siegfried (FRIEDRICH) Gary Warner schrieb: > To all, > > We have the Heinrich Johann Hertes family from Plock in our Master > Pedigree database. Three of the children marry into Fercho, and > Richert families. Since this data is also in the SGGEE001 file, I > expect that the records that we have are more numerous than just this > one family. I will contact Roland separately. > > Gary Warner > > On 1/11/2010 6:26 AM, Jerry Frank wrote: > >> The following message was posted from Germany. The poster is not a >> subscriber so please respond personally if you can help. His email >> address is: >> >> roland.hertes at t-online.de >> >> Hello, >> >> My family lived in Poland around 1800 to 1845 in the region of Plock. >> One of the HERTES families migrated from Poland to the USA and Canada. >> I seek information about the following families. >> >> Buchholtz >> Ferchau >> Hertes >> Richert >> >> With friendly greetings, >> >> Roland Hertes >> >> ---------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> Hallo, >> >> meine Familie war von etwa 1800 - 1945 in Polen wohnhaft, und zwar >> haupts?chlich im Raum Plock. >> Einige Angeh?rige der Familie HERTES sind von Polen aus nach USA und >> Canada ausgewandert. >> >> Ich suche Informationen ?ber folgende Familien: >> >> BUCHHOLTZ >> FERCHAU, >> HERTES >> RICHERT >> >> Mit freundlichen Gr??en >> Roland (Hertes) >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > From siegfried at familie-friedrich.de Mon Jan 11 11:23:24 2010 From: siegfried at familie-friedrich.de (Siegfried Friedrich) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 20:23:24 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region Message-ID: <4B4B7AAC.7060907@familie-friedrich.de> Hello Roland, I've found the village chronicle of Nowe Boryszewo (Tiefenbach), Plock, from Franz Lackner. Here you can read something about the people, which settled in 1824 and lived there since 1945. for example: BUCHHOLTZ und FERCHAU. I found it, because I search for FRIEDRICH. I'm further interested. http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/VillageChronicles.htm http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/LacknerChronik.pdf http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/NoweBoryszewo_D.htm Best regards Siegfried (FRIEDRICH) Gary Warner schrieb: > To all, > > We have the Heinrich Johann Hertes family from Plock in our Master > Pedigree database. Three of the children marry into Fercho, and > Richert families. Since this data is also in the SGGEE001 file, I > expect that the records that we have are more numerous than just this > one family. I will contact Roland separately. > > Gary Warner > > On 1/11/2010 6:26 AM, Jerry Frank wrote: > >> The following message was posted from Germany. The poster is not a >> subscriber so please respond personally if you can help. His email >> address is: >> >> roland.hertes at t-online.de >> >> Hello, >> >> My family lived in Poland around 1800 to 1845 in the region of Plock. >> One of the HERTES families migrated from Poland to the USA and Canada. >> I seek information about the following families. >> >> Buchholtz >> Ferchau >> Hertes >> Richert >> >> With friendly greetings, >> >> Roland Hertes >> >> ---------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> Hallo, >> >> meine Familie war von etwa 1800 - 1945 in Polen wohnhaft, und zwar >> haupts?chlich im Raum Plock. >> Einige Angeh?rige der Familie HERTES sind von Polen aus nach USA und >> Canada ausgewandert. >> >> Ich suche Informationen ?ber folgende Familien: >> >> BUCHHOLTZ >> FERCHAU, >> HERTES >> RICHERT >> >> Mit freundlichen Gr??en >> Roland (Hertes) >> From mag_ton at yahoo.com Mon Jan 11 14:08:42 2010 From: mag_ton at yahoo.com (Tony & Magda) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 14:08:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Ger-Poland-Volhynia Digest, Vol 80, Issue 11 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <612802.23264.qm@web112408.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> ?Thanks for Plock's Nowe Boryszewo link . FERCHAU is a name I see frequently on the records there . My Ziemer / Abraham family and direct ancestor was born and bapized there before they moved onward to Zambrow region in 1850's. Magda --- On Mon, 1/11/10, ger-poland-volhynia-request at eclipse.sggee.org wrote: From: ger-poland-volhynia-request at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: Ger-Poland-Volhynia Digest, Vol 80, Issue 11 To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Date: Monday, January 11, 2010, 3:00 PM Send Ger-Poland-Volhynia mailing list submissions to ??? ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit ??? http://eclipse.sggee.org/mailman/listinfo/ger-poland-volhynia or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ??? ger-poland-volhynia-request at eclipse.sggee.org You can reach the person managing the list at ??? ger-poland-volhynia-owner at eclipse.sggee.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Ger-Poland-Volhynia digest..." Today's Topics: ???1. Re: Volhynia place names (Dave Proper) ???2. Family search in Plock region (Jerry Frank) ???3. Re: Family search in Plock region (Gary Warner) ???4. Re: Family search in Plock region (Siegfried Friedrich) ???5. Re: Family search in Plock region (Siegfried Friedrich) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2010 20:04:34 -0800 From: "Dave Proper" Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Volhynia place names To: "'Jerry Frank'" Cc: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain;??? charset="us-ascii" Jerry, Thanks for the tip! I finally had time to sit down and give this a try. The "Pastor's path" showed the next village to be Glueckstal so I can feel confident that my initial section Bolarka #4 (the closest of the six) is most likely the correct one. Dave Proper ? _____? From: Jerry Frank [mailto:FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca] Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 6:14 AM To: Dave Proper Cc: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Volhynia place names Dave, Probably the best way to figure this out is by using our "Route of the Pastor" search function at http://www.sggee.org/members/StPeteByRoute (Members Only). The pastor would travel from village to village collecting info from the local Kantor.? These villages would be in close proximity to each other.? By looking at which villages were visited in sequence, and then looking on the map for that grouping, you will probably be able to figure out which is the correct Bolarka. Jerry Frank Calgary, AB Dave Proper wrote: Hi All, I have started the process of standardizing my Polish and Volhynian place names according to the new SGGEE Guidelines for places. Thus far I have done the easy ones and now am getting to the last few that are much harder to resolve. My current quandary is the all-to-common multiple place names that can exist with in a very small area. Case-in-point: I have a Gustave Adolph Kugler, b. 29 Oct 1871. Before it was easy - he was simply born in Bolarka, Volhynia (from the St Petersburg Consistory records). Now the gazetteer for Volhynia presents me with six choices to nail down the specific location: 1)Bolarka (Bialogrodka/Bilohorodka), Dubno, Rivne, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 501837 253247 2)Bolarka (Sosnowa-Bolarka/Vesnianka), Chervonoarmiisk, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 503411 281616 3)Bolarka-Radecka (Radziecka-Bolarka/Radetska Boliarka), Chervonoarmiisk, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 503524 281513 4)Boljarka (Balarka/Boliarka), Novohrad-Volynskyi, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 503030 274530 5)Boljarka (Bolarka Stara/Boliarka), Zhytomyr, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 501938 282127 6)Boljarka (Bolarka-Prosiecka/Boliarka), Yemilchyne, Zhytomyr, Russian Empire (Ukraine) 505100 273900 My first thought was "where were his siblings born?" An older brother, a younger sister and two younger brothers were all born in Glueckstal (all from the St Petes records). So which of the Bolarka's is the closest to Glueckstal and most likely of the six? That results in a list like this: #4 - 29 km #5 - 42 km #2 - 50 km #3 - 51 km #6 - 67 km #1 - 171 km So now I am leaning towards #4 but still looking for something further to tie it to that place. I looked at the Volhynian parish formation list http://www.sggee.org/research/parishes/parish_histories/VolhynianParishesDia gram.pdf and in the year 1871 there were four parishes - Shitomir, Kiev, Rozyszcze and Heimtal so that doesn't seem to provide and any further refinement. Without any further information a reasonable person would opt for Bolarka #4. Does anyone have further insight as to how to make the selection? Or should the option at the bottom of page 8 of the guidelines be used - Bolarka (many found),,,Poland? Dave Proper p/s Thanks to Frank Stewner and the others who put in countless hours creating these wonderfull new research tools! _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv ? ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 07:26:40 -0700 From: Jerry Frank Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region To: "ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org" ??? Message-ID: <4B4B3520.7070307 at sggee.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed The following message was posted from Germany.? The poster is not a subscriber so please respond personally if you can help.? His email address is: roland.hertes at t-online.de Hello, My family lived in Poland around 1800 to 1845 in the region of Plock.? One of the HERTES families migrated from Poland to the USA and Canada.? I seek information about the following families. Buchholtz Ferchau Hertes Richert With friendly greetings, Roland Hertes ---------------------------------------------------- Hallo, meine Familie war von etwa 1800 - 1945 in Polen wohnhaft, und zwar haupts?chlich im Raum Plock. Einige Angeh?rige der Familie HERTES sind von Polen aus nach USA und Canada ausgewandert. Ich suche Informationen ?ber folgende Familien: BUCHHOLTZ FERCHAU, HERTES RICHERT Mit freundlichen Gr??en Roland (Hertes) ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 08:32:53 -0800 From: Gary Warner Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region To: Jerry Frank Cc: "ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org" ??? Message-ID: <4B4B52B5.4050305 at warnerengineering.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed To all, We have the Heinrich Johann Hertes family from Plock in our Master Pedigree database.???Three of the children marry into Fercho, and Richert families.???Since this data is also in the SGGEE001 file, I expect that the records that we have are more numerous than just this one family.? I will contact Roland separately. Gary Warner On 1/11/2010 6:26 AM, Jerry Frank wrote: > The following message was posted from Germany.? The poster is not a > subscriber so please respond personally if you can help.? His email > address is: > > roland.hertes at t-online.de > > Hello, > > My family lived in Poland around 1800 to 1845 in the region of Plock. > One of the HERTES families migrated from Poland to the USA and Canada. > I seek information about the following families. > > Buchholtz > Ferchau > Hertes > Richert > > With friendly greetings, > > Roland Hertes > > ---------------------------------------------------- > > > Hallo, > > meine Familie war von etwa 1800 - 1945 in Polen wohnhaft, und zwar > haupts?chlich im Raum Plock. > Einige Angeh?rige der Familie HERTES sind von Polen aus nach USA und > Canada ausgewandert. > > Ich suche Informationen ?ber folgende Familien: > > BUCHHOLTZ > FERCHAU, > HERTES > RICHERT > > Mit freundlichen Gr??en > Roland (Hertes) > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > >? ? ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 20:15:10 +0100 From: Siegfried Friedrich Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region Cc: Roland Hertes ,??? Jerry Frank ??? ,??? "ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org" ??? Message-ID: <4B4B78BE.8030205 at familie-friedrich.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hello Roland, I've found the village chronicle of Nowe Boryszewo (Tiefenbach), Plock, from Franz Lackner. Here you can read something about the? people, which settled in 1824 and lived there since 1945. for example:? ? ???BUCHHOLTZ? und FERCHAU. I found it, because I search for FRIEDRICH. I'm further interested. http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/VillageChronicles.htm http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/LacknerChronik.pdf http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/NoweBoryszewo_D.htm Best regards Siegfried (FRIEDRICH) Gary Warner schrieb: > To all, > > We have the Heinrich Johann Hertes family from Plock in our Master > Pedigree database.???Three of the children marry into Fercho, and > Richert families.???Since this data is also in the SGGEE001 file, I > expect that the records that we have are more numerous than just this > one family.? I will contact Roland separately. > > Gary Warner > > On 1/11/2010 6:26 AM, Jerry Frank wrote: >??? >> The following message was posted from Germany.? The poster is not a >> subscriber so please respond personally if you can help.? His email >> address is: >> >> roland.hertes at t-online.de >> >> Hello, >> >> My family lived in Poland around 1800 to 1845 in the region of Plock. >> One of the HERTES families migrated from Poland to the USA and Canada. >> I seek information about the following families. >> >> Buchholtz >> Ferchau >> Hertes >> Richert >> >> With friendly greetings, >> >> Roland Hertes >> >> ---------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> Hallo, >> >> meine Familie war von etwa 1800 - 1945 in Polen wohnhaft, und zwar >> haupts?chlich im Raum Plock. >> Einige Angeh?rige der Familie HERTES sind von Polen aus nach USA und >> Canada ausgewandert. >> >> Ich suche Informationen ?ber folgende Familien: >> >> BUCHHOLTZ >> FERCHAU, >> HERTES >> RICHERT >> >> Mit freundlichen Gr??en >> Roland (Hertes) >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> >>? ? >>? ??? > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > >??? ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 20:23:24 +0100 From: Siegfried Friedrich Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region To: ML-Ger-Pol-Mailliste Message-ID: <4B4B7AAC.7060907 at familie-friedrich.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15 Hello Roland, I've found the village chronicle of Nowe Boryszewo (Tiefenbach), Plock, from Franz Lackner. Here you can read something about the? people, which settled in 1824 and lived there since 1945. for example:? ? ???BUCHHOLTZ? und FERCHAU. I found it, because I search for FRIEDRICH. I'm further interested. http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/VillageChronicles.htm http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/LacknerChronik.pdf http://www.upstreamvistula.org/Documents/NoweBoryszewo_D.htm Best regards Siegfried (FRIEDRICH) Gary Warner schrieb: > To all, > > We have the Heinrich Johann Hertes family from Plock in our Master > Pedigree database.???Three of the children marry into Fercho, and > Richert families.???Since this data is also in the SGGEE001 file, I > expect that the records that we have are more numerous than just this > one family.? I will contact Roland separately. > > Gary Warner > > On 1/11/2010 6:26 AM, Jerry Frank wrote: >??? >> The following message was posted from Germany.? The poster is not a >> subscriber so please respond personally if you can help.? His email >> address is: >> >> roland.hertes at t-online.de >> >> Hello, >> >> My family lived in Poland around 1800 to 1845 in the region of Plock. >> One of the HERTES families migrated from Poland to the USA and Canada. >> I seek information about the following families. >> >> Buchholtz >> Ferchau >> Hertes >> Richert >> >> With friendly greetings, >> >> Roland Hertes >> >> ---------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> Hallo, >> >> meine Familie war von etwa 1800 - 1945 in Polen wohnhaft, und zwar >> haupts?chlich im Raum Plock. >> Einige Angeh?rige der Familie HERTES sind von Polen aus nach USA und >> Canada ausgewandert. >> >> Ich suche Informationen ?ber folgende Familien: >> >> BUCHHOLTZ >> FERCHAU, >> HERTES >> RICHERT >> >> Mit freundlichen Gr??en >> Roland (Hertes) >> ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia mailing list, hosted by the: Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe? http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv.html End of Ger-Poland-Volhynia Digest, Vol 80, Issue 11 *************************************************** From mag_ton at yahoo.com Mon Jan 11 14:33:55 2010 From: mag_ton at yahoo.com (Tony & Magda) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 14:33:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Chodecz / Mielno Message-ID: <451420.60164.qm@web112409.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> If I have not found an ancestor's? baptism 1800-1803 in the Catholic Records of Chodecz? ( she was listed as being born in Konty Hollandry - also known as Katy , Wloclawk - in her marriage record of 1820 in Chodecz ) , what is the next possible parish I should seek her baptismal , assuming the family is German Lutheran . I have not located this particuat family in it at all . The name of the family is ABRAHAM . Magda From mag_ton at yahoo.com Mon Jan 11 14:41:40 2010 From: mag_ton at yahoo.com (Tony & Magda) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 14:41:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Chodecz / Mielno Message-ID: <419903.91306.qm@web112404.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> ? I forgot to mention that I already did Lubie? Kujawski records ?? Magda , From: Tony & Magda Subject: Chodecz / Mielno To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Date: Monday, January 11, 2010, 5:33 PM If I have not found an ancestor's? baptism 1800-1803 in the Catholic Records of Chodecz? ( she was listed as being born in Konty Hollandry - also known as Katy , Wloclawk - in her marriage record of 1820 in Chodecz ) , what is the next possible parish I should seek her baptismal , assuming the family is German Lutheran . I have not located this particular family in it at all . The name of the family is ABRAHAM . Magda From Hannes.Werner at online.de Mon Jan 11 15:15:46 2010 From: Hannes.Werner at online.de (Hannes Werner) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 00:15:46 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Chodecz / Mielno References: <451420.60164.qm@web112409.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000601ca9314$01b09860$14b2a8c0@end2000> Hi Magda, don't know whether it helps: i just looked at some registers of Chodziez EVANG. parish from 1818 ff. Abraham, Anna Luisa Abraham, Johann August Abraham, Johann Concordia Abraham, Gottlieb Abraham, Maria Elisabeth and 1819-20 oo Johann Krause oo Apollonia Abraham *Abraham, Samuel Benjamin Abraham, Johann Michael Abraham, Johann Ludwig Abraham, Anna Rosina Abraham, Johann Gottlieb Abraham, Wilhelm Ferdinand Abraham, Johann Eduard Abraham, Johann Wilhelm maybe you'll find more at lutheran church ? Hannes W. Germany ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony & Magda" To: Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 11:33 PM Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Chodecz / Mielno If I have not found an ancestor's baptism 1800-1803 in the Catholic Records of Chodecz ( she was listed as being born in Konty Hollandry - also known as Katy , Wloclawk - in her marriage record of 1820 in Chodecz ) , what is the next possible parish I should seek her baptismal , assuming the family is German Lutheran . I have not located this particuat family in it at all . The name of the family is ABRAHAM . Magda _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca Mon Jan 11 15:26:11 2010 From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca (Jerry Frank) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 16:26:11 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Chodecz / Mielno In-Reply-To: <419903.91306.qm@web112404.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <419903.91306.qm@web112404.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: My second choice after Lubien Catholic would be Lanieta though available records appear to only start in 1808.? You could at least see if you could find other Abrahams there.? The FHLC website search section is undergoing problems right now so I can't check microfilm availability but that location does come up in Polish Archives search. Third choice would be Dabrowice.? There are lots of Germans recorded there but the road route from Katy is somewhat circuitous so it seems less likely they would be there. Jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: Tony & Magda Date: Monday, January 11, 2010 3:44 pm Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Chodecz / Mielno To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > > > ? I forgot to mention that I already did Lubie? Kujawski records > > ?? Magda , > > From: Tony & Magda > Subject: Chodecz / Mielno > To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Date: Monday, January 11, 2010, 5:33 PM > > If I have not found an ancestor's? baptism 1800-1803 in the > Catholic Records of Chodecz? ( she was listed as being born in > Konty Hollandry - also known as Katy , Wloclawk - in her > marriage record of 1820 in Chodecz ) , what is the next possible > parish I should seek her baptismal , assuming the family is > German Lutheran . I have not located this particular family in > it at all . The name of the family is ABRAHAM . > > Magda > > > > > > > ????? > > > ????? > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From ra_stein at telus.net Mon Jan 11 15:55:43 2010 From: ra_stein at telus.net (Richard Stein) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 16:55:43 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Chodecz / Mielno In-Reply-To: <419903.91306.qm@web112404.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <419903.91306.qm@web112404.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Magda, I did the extraction of German names from the Chodecz Catholic parish microfilms. I assume your ancestor is Euphrosine Abrabam, daughter of Johann Abraham and his wife Kartharine. I found a couple Johann Abraham / Katharine who had children Jacob born 1790 and Kartharine born 1792, both in Josefki. The two couples could be the same and may have moved to Katy sometime after 1792. A problem with finding records on Germans around Chodecz is that the Chodecz Lutheran (Evangelical) church did not operate continuously from its founding in 1801, probably due to lack of a pastor at times. In years when the Lutheran church was not operating, the number of events for Germans registered in the Catholic Church was high, otherwise it was low. For example, in 1817 there were 39 German baptisms in the Catholic church, in 1818 it was 3. The BIG problem is that the very early Chodecz Lutheran records appear to be not available, probably due to the intermittent operation of the church. Thus, the birth record of your Euphrosine Abraham may very well be in those missing Lutheran records. However, Katy is quite a long way from Chodecz and people may well have registered their births at a closer church as Jerry just suggested. Perhaps someone on the list knows more about the early Chodecz Lutheran church books. Dick Stein ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony & Magda" To: Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 3:41 PM Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Chodecz / Mielno > > > I forgot to mention that I already did Lubie? Kujawski records > > Magda , > > From: Tony & Magda > Subject: Chodecz / Mielno > To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Date: Monday, January 11, 2010, 5:33 PM > > If I have not found an ancestor's baptism 1800-1803 in the Catholic > Records of Chodecz ( she was listed as being born in Konty Hollandry - > also known as Katy , Wloclawk - in her marriage record of 1820 in > Chodecz ) , what is the next possible parish I should seek her baptismal , > assuming the family is German Lutheran . I have not located this > particular family in it at all . The name of the family is ABRAHAM . > > Magda > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From hjkamm at charter.net Mon Jan 11 17:24:01 2010 From: hjkamm at charter.net (Hal and Jan Kamm) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 20:24:01 -0500 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Kaminski and Sebroski from Rypin Message-ID: <8A1051C1-67C2-4AF5-AE1A-BAB711D4CA13@charter.net> I have been researching my paternal grandparents and think that Ludwig and Arthur Kaminski came from Rypin and/or Plock in 1900 for Ludwig, 1907 for Arthur, and my grandmother Mary Sebroski (orZabroski) came in 1889. Ludwig and Arthur's parents were John Kaminski and Louisa Brinkmann or Brickmann. Mary's parents were John Sebroski and mother was Sophie ?Kommroske. Other close family friends from Rypin were Krupps (Otto, Ottilie, Henry, Oscar, Leopold, Helen) whose father was Emil Krupp, mother was Natalie. Also Otto Neske who came from Rypin about 1902. I joined SGGEE recently and have not found anything on this site that sheds light on these families. What other resources are available through SGGEE? Thanks Hal Kamm From gary at warnerengineering.com Mon Jan 11 21:17:44 2010 From: gary at warnerengineering.com (Gary Warner) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 21:17:44 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Kaminski and Sebroski from Rypin In-Reply-To: <8A1051C1-67C2-4AF5-AE1A-BAB711D4CA13@charter.net> References: <8A1051C1-67C2-4AF5-AE1A-BAB711D4CA13@charter.net> Message-ID: <4B4C05F8.6010104@warnerengineering.com> Hal, I do not see any Brinkmann or Brickmann names in our databases that seem to fit the information that you have provided. I also do not see any records that seem to match up for Sebroski or Zabroski or Kaminski. You will want to keep an open mind when you look for surnames that end in ski, as they may be the Polish version of a German name. For instance, it is well documented that Kaminski (from the Polish word Kamien, meaning stone) is linked to the German name Stein and Steinke (both of which have Stein, or stone as part of the name. I have no hard evidence, but it appears that the Polish language is a bit vague in translations at times, so the German name might be anything with Stein as part of the name, including Koberstein, or other names. I also do not see any records that match with the data you have given below using names that have Stein as part of the name. The best way to find out if any of our data matches yours, however, is for you to submit a gedcom file with your data in it. Please see the submittal standards at http://sggee.org/about_us/db_submittal_instruct.pdf Gary Warner SGGEE On 1/11/2010 5:24 PM, Hal and Jan Kamm wrote: > I have been researching my paternal grandparents and think that Ludwig and Arthur Kaminski came from Rypin and/or Plock in 1900 for Ludwig, 1907 for Arthur, and my grandmother Mary Sebroski (orZabroski) came in 1889. > > Ludwig and Arthur's parents were John Kaminski and Louisa Brinkmann or Brickmann. > > Mary's parents were John Sebroski and mother was Sophie ?Kommroske. > > Other close family friends from Rypin were Krupps (Otto, Ottilie, Henry, Oscar, Leopold, Helen) whose father was Emil Krupp, mother was Natalie. > > Also Otto Neske who came from Rypin about 1902. > > I joined SGGEE recently and have not found anything on this site that sheds light on these families. > > What other resources are available through SGGEE? > > Thanks > > Hal Kamm > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From krampetz at aol.com Mon Jan 11 21:55:47 2010 From: krampetz at aol.com (krampetz@aol.com) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 00:55:47 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Kaminski and Sebroski from Rypin Message-ID: <19217.5037dc35.387d68e3@aol.com> My own Polish grandmother, married to Joseph Niewiera Arrived with her daughter, my mother, under the NOT MISPELLED names of Roszalia and Mary Niewierowa .. The female ending of his name. (which they apparently dropped after being here) I've also seen a 'y' added to the end of Jakuc, and 'o' endings changed to 'a' for women in a Polish family. There are a number of other odd (to us present day people) endings for feminine name forms of Polish surnames. I'm sure there's a list somewhere. So use the Steve Morse web site when searching Ellis Island, and leave off the last letter or two. _http://stevemorse.org/ellis2/ellisgold.html_ (http://stevemorse.org/ellis2/ellisgold.html) I never would've found 'em without it. Bob In a message dated 1/11/2010 9:19:47 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, gary at warnerengineering.com writes: Hal, I do not see any Brinkmann or Brickmann names in our databases that seem to fit the information that you have provided. I also do not see any records that seem to match up for Sebroski or Zabroski or Kaminski. You will want to keep an open mind when you look for surnames that end in ski, as they may be the Polish version of a German name. For instance, it is well documented that Kaminski (from the Polish word Kamien, meaning stone) is linked to the German name Stein and Steinke (both of which have Stein, or stone as part of the name. I have no hard evidence, but it appears that the Polish language is a bit vague in translations at times, so the German name might be anything with Stein as part of the name, including Koberstein, or other names. I also do not see any records that match with the data you have given below using names that have Stein as part of the name. The best way to find out if any of our data matches yours, however, is for you to submit a gedcom file with your data in it. Please see the submittal standards at http://sggee.org/about_us/db_submittal_instruct.pdf Gary Warner SGGEE On 1/11/2010 5:24 PM, Hal and Jan Kamm wrote: > I have been researching my paternal grandparents and think that Ludwig and Arthur Kaminski came from Rypin and/or Plock in 1900 for Ludwig, 1907 for Arthur, and my grandmother Mary Sebroski (orZabroski) came in 1889. > > Ludwig and Arthur's parents were John Kaminski and Louisa Brinkmann or Brickmann. > > Mary's parents were John Sebroski and mother was Sophie ?Kommroske. > > Other close family friends from Rypin were Krupps (Otto, Ottilie, Henry, Oscar, Leopold, Helen) whose father was Emil Krupp, mother was Natalie. > > Also Otto Neske who came from Rypin about 1902. > > I joined SGGEE recently and have not found anything on this site that sheds light on these families. > > What other resources are available through SGGEE? > > Thanks > > Hal Kamm > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca Mon Jan 11 22:14:54 2010 From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca (Jerry Frank) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 23:14:54 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Kaminski and Sebroski from Rypin In-Reply-To: <8A1051C1-67C2-4AF5-AE1A-BAB711D4CA13@charter.net> References: <8A1051C1-67C2-4AF5-AE1A-BAB711D4CA13@charter.net> Message-ID: <4B4C135E.5060000@shaw.ca> What religion did these families practice? Most of the data on our site is German Lutheran, Baptist, or Moravian Brethern. If your family was Catholic, there will be little data for you. Jerry Frank Calgary, AB Hal and Jan Kamm wrote: > I have been researching my paternal grandparents and think that Ludwig and Arthur Kaminski came from Rypin and/or Plock in 1900 for Ludwig, 1907 for Arthur, and my grandmother Mary Sebroski (orZabroski) came in 1889. > > Ludwig and Arthur's parents were John Kaminski and Louisa Brinkmann or Brickmann. > > Mary's parents were John Sebroski and mother was Sophie ?Kommroske. > > Other close family friends from Rypin were Krupps (Otto, Ottilie, Henry, Oscar, Leopold, Helen) whose father was Emil Krupp, mother was Natalie. > > Also Otto Neske who came from Rypin about 1902. > > I joined SGGEE recently and have not found anything on this site that sheds light on these families. > > What other resources are available through SGGEE? > > Thanks > > Hal Kamm > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > From hjkamm at charter.net Tue Jan 12 04:17:34 2010 From: hjkamm at charter.net (Hal and Jan Kamm) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 07:17:34 -0500 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Kaminski and Sebroski from Rypin In-Reply-To: <4B4C135E.5060000@shaw.ca> References: <8A1051C1-67C2-4AF5-AE1A-BAB711D4CA13@charter.net> <4B4C135E.5060000@shaw.ca> Message-ID: They were German Lutherans. All of their immigration and naturalization records, NYC marriage records, refer to Russian Poland as their origin, German ethnicity, and Rypien or Plock as their hometown. Hal On Jan 12, 2010, at 1:14 AM, Jerry Frank wrote: > What religion did these families practice? Most of the data on our site is German Lutheran, Baptist, or Moravian Brethern. If your family was Catholic, there will be little data for you. > > > Jerry Frank > Calgary, AB > > > Hal and Jan Kamm wrote: >> >> I have been researching my paternal grandparents and think that Ludwig and Arthur Kaminski came from Rypin and/or Plock in 1900 for Ludwig, 1907 for Arthur, and my grandmother Mary Sebroski (orZabroski) came in 1889. >> >> Ludwig and Arthur's parents were John Kaminski and Louisa Brinkmann or Brickmann. >> >> Mary's parents were John Sebroski and mother was Sophie ?Kommroske. >> >> Other close family friends from Rypin were Krupps (Otto, Ottilie, Henry, Oscar, Leopold, Helen) whose father was Emil Krupp, mother was Natalie. >> >> Also Otto Neske who came from Rypin about 1902. >> >> I joined SGGEE recently and have not found anything on this site that sheds light on these families. >> >> What other resources are available through SGGEE? >> >> Thanks >> >> Hal Kamm >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> >> From joepessarra at suddenlink.net Tue Jan 12 05:41:31 2010 From: joepessarra at suddenlink.net (joepessarra) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 07:41:31 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Kaminski and Sebroski from Rypin In-Reply-To: References: <8A1051C1-67C2-4AF5-AE1A-BAB711D4CA13@charter.net> <4B4C135E.5060000@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <000601ca938c$f3655790$da3006b0$@net> Poland phone directory at http://www.ksiazka-telefoniczna.com/ has 8 listings of Kaminski in Rypin, and over 20 Kaminski listings in Plock. And, there are other Kaminski in towns very close to Rypin. Could not locate any Sebroski/Zabroski in Rypin or Plock. Maybe some contact with some of these possible distant relatives would help you in your ancestry search. Good luck. Joe in Texas -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Hal and Jan Kamm Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2010 6:18 AM To: Jerry Frank Cc: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Kaminski and Sebroski from Rypin They were German Lutherans. All of their immigration and naturalization records, NYC marriage records, refer to Russian Poland as their origin, German ethnicity, and Rypien or Plock as their hometown. Hal On Jan 12, 2010, at 1:14 AM, Jerry Frank wrote: > What religion did these families practice? Most of the data on our site is German Lutheran, Baptist, or Moravian Brethern. If your family was Catholic, there will be little data for you. > > > Jerry Frank > Calgary, AB > > > Hal and Jan Kamm wrote: >> >> I have been researching my paternal grandparents and think that Ludwig and Arthur Kaminski came from Rypin and/or Plock in 1900 for Ludwig, 1907 for Arthur, and my grandmother Mary Sebroski (orZabroski) came in 1889. >> >> Ludwig and Arthur's parents were John Kaminski and Louisa Brinkmann or Brickmann. >> >> Mary's parents were John Sebroski and mother was Sophie ?Kommroske. >> >> Other close family friends from Rypin were Krupps (Otto, Ottilie, Henry, Oscar, Leopold, Helen) whose father was Emil Krupp, mother was Natalie. >> >> Also Otto Neske who came from Rypin about 1902. >> >> I joined SGGEE recently and have not found anything on this site that sheds light on these families. >> >> What other resources are available through SGGEE? >> >> Thanks >> >> Hal Kamm >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by >> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org >> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv >> >> _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From benovich at imt.net Tue Jan 12 11:23:06 2010 From: benovich at imt.net (Richard Benert) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 12:23:06 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] an overlooked book Message-ID: I recently, quite by accident, discovered a book which conveniently covers the subject of German migrations since the Middle Ages in only 55 pages, plus 20 pages of (418) footnotes. It is "Migrations and Cultures" by Thomas Sowell (Harper Collins, Basic Books, 1996). The book also treats migration patterns of other cultures--Japanese, Chinese, Italians, Jews and Indians--so it necessarily has to skim over the top of things, but it seems to me to be an excellent introduction for newcomers to the subject in general, or for many of us who are familiar with GR migration to North America but are largely ignorant about GRs in Brazil, Paraguay, Chile, Mexico and Australia. Of course he begins with German migration into eastern Europe and Russia. Perhaps everyone but me has been aware of this book all along, but I've found it referred to only once (March 24, 2001) in the GR-Heritage archives, by Timothy Kloberdanz, so I don't think I'm alone in my ignorance. Sowell is an economist/sociologist of a basically libertarian stripe (Wikipedia has an article on his life and writings), and his account deals chiefly with economic matters. He doesn't hesitate to give German migrants credit for their prowess in this regard. The enterprising spirit of migratory Germans (and others) lends support to his laissez-faire attitude to public policy. The presence of this book in over 1600 libraries in the U.S. attests to Sowell's popularity, at least in the U.S. While I think the book is a good introduction as an overview of the subject, it has its limitations. For two people (he and his one assistant) to cover such a vast subject along with pursuing other interests means a certain degree of superficiality. Errors are not entirely absent, as when he states that Germans in the U.S. during World War Two encountered "no such hostility" as they had during the First World War. In other instances, he commits sins of omission. It is inconceivable that an economist would fail to mention the expropriation of German-owned land in Russia in 1915-16. He refers to it only obliquely by saying that the Volga Germans were "banished" in 1917. He mentions the deportation of Germans to the Volga, Central Asia and Siberia in 1915 from "one of the Ukrainian provinces," failing to mention the name of that province (Volhynia) as well as the fact that thousands of Germans in Russian Poland were also deported. Sowell bases his story on some of our favorite historians (Adam Giesinger, Fred Koch, Hattie Plum Williams, Richard Sallet, plus a few articles by Fleischhauer, Kloberdanz, and others). But he amazingly failed to consult James W. Long, "From Privileged to Dispossessed," on the Volga Germans, and Joseph Height and Dietmar Neutatz on the Black Sea and Volhynian Germans. Fleischhauer's "Die Deutschen im Zarenreich" is not mentioned. He seems only vaguely aware of the Volhynian Germans as a separate group in that "Ukrainian province." My own ignorance of the literature on Germans in South America and Australia prevents me from commenting on those portions of his treatment. Nevertheless I think that for anyone new to the pursuit of GR ancestors and their history, this book is a good place to begin. His footnotes provide a wide selection of books and articles for further reading, even if some major sources are overlooked. Chances are good that the book is in a local library near you, and there are several copies for sale online. From ironhide781 at hotmail.com Thu Jan 14 15:31:54 2010 From: ironhide781 at hotmail.com (Brandt Gibson) Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2010 15:31:54 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England Message-ID: Hi all, I'm looking for some help in tracing the emigration route of my ancestors, Samuel and Pauline (Rosen) Joseph and their kids. They arrived in Montreal, Quebec on October 5, 1910 on the S.S. Tunisian, which left Liverpool, England a week or so before. I don't know when or how they got to England, and would appreciate any help anyone could offer on researching this. The only clues I have as to where they originated in Russia are in the Canadian border crossing records. In them, Sam stated he was from Olanuwka/Ulanowka or Zitomar (depending on the record). Thanks! Brandt Gibson Fife, WA _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390710/direct/01/ From FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca Thu Jan 14 16:06:51 2010 From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca (Jerry Frank) Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2010 17:06:51 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Brandt, For a description of the migration of our ancestors across England from Hull to Liverpool, see http://www.norwayheritage.com/articles/templates/voyages.asp?articleid=28&zoneid=6 Now, stepping backwards, most migration to Canada started with a ticket from Hamburg, Germany.? Migration to Hamburg was typical by two routes.? One by horse and wagon and/or train from Volhynia via Warsaw to Hamburg.? The other by horse and wagon and train from Volhynia to Libau and then by boat to Hamburg. Ulanowka is a known Germanic village in Volhynia and our maps should help you to identify it. Jerry Frank ----- Original Message ----- From: Brandt Gibson Date: Thursday, January 14, 2010 4:35 pm Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > > Hi all, > > ? > > I'm looking for some help in tracing the emigration route of my > ancestors, Samuel and Pauline (Rosen) Joseph and their kids. > They arrived in Montreal, Quebec on October 5, 1910 on the S.S. > Tunisian, which left Liverpool, England a week or so before. I > don't know when or how they got to England, and would appreciate > any help anyone could offer on researching this. The only clues > I have as to where they originated in Russia are in the Canadian > border crossing records. In them, Sam stated he was from > Olanuwka/Ulanowka or Zitomar (depending on the record). > > ? > > Thanks! > > ? > > Brandt Gibson > > Fife, WA > ?????????????????????????????????????????????? > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390710/direct/01/ > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From colnels at telus.net Thu Jan 14 16:20:27 2010 From: colnels at telus.net (Nelson Itterman) Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2010 17:20:27 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000301ca9578$8a61f490$9f25ddb0$@net> My family boarded a train in Zhitomir and went to Moscow then to Riga Latvia and a ship to London, England, then by train to Liverpool and a ship to St. John, New Brunswick. I believe this was all arranged by the CPR in Winnipeg. Nelson -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Brandt Gibson Sent: January-14-10 4:32 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England Hi all, I'm looking for some help in tracing the emigration route of my ancestors, Samuel and Pauline (Rosen) Joseph and their kids. They arrived in Montreal, Quebec on October 5, 1910 on the S.S. Tunisian, which left Liverpool, England a week or so before. I don't know when or how they got to England, and would appreciate any help anyone could offer on researching this. The only clues I have as to where they originated in Russia are in the Canadian border crossing records. In them, Sam stated he was from Olanuwka/Ulanowka or Zitomar (depending on the record). Thanks! Brandt Gibson Fife, WA _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390710/direct/01/ _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From hgillespie at rogers.com Thu Jan 14 17:47:46 2010 From: hgillespie at rogers.com (Helen Gillespie) Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2010 17:47:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England In-Reply-To: <000301ca9578$8a61f490$9f25ddb0$@net> Message-ID: <792749.95654.qm@web88005.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Found an interesting article on emigration from Eastern Europe, although much relates to Jewish emigration ..... http://www.thebakers.ie/trains%20and%20shelters%20and%20ships.htm One branch of my Baier family emigrated from Volhynia via Riga (the train goes there from Aleksandrija Kr. Rowno) and thence to Liverpool before going to New York - arriving December 24 1904. From there to Benton Harbor, MI..... And curiously the ship's manifest listed them as the Menginger family - but all of their first name's and ages matched my Baier family - and their sponsor family was Menginger, so I figured the agent simplified the process and changed their names. Helen --- On Fri, 1/15/10, Nelson Itterman wrote: > From: Nelson Itterman > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England > To: "'Brandt Gibson'" , ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Date: Friday, January 15, 2010, 12:20 AM > My family boarded a train in Zhitomir > and went to Moscow then to Riga Latvia > and a ship to London, England, then by train to Liverpool > and a ship to St. > John, New Brunswick. I believe this was all arranged by the > CPR in Winnipeg. > Nelson > > -----Original Message----- > From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org > [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] > On Behalf Of Brandt > Gibson > Sent: January-14-10 4:32 PM > To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England > > > Hi all, > > > > I'm looking for some help in tracing the emigration route > of my ancestors, > Samuel and Pauline (Rosen) Joseph and their kids. They > arrived in Montreal, > Quebec on October 5, 1910 on the S.S. Tunisian, which left > Liverpool, > England a week or so before. I don't know when or how they > got to England, > and would appreciate any help anyone could offer on > researching this. The > only clues I have as to where they originated in Russia are > in the Canadian > border crossing records. In them, Sam stated he was from > Olanuwka/Ulanowka > or Zitomar (depending on the record). > > > > Thanks! > > > > Brandt Gibson > > Fife, WA > ??? > ???????? > ?????? ??? > ? > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390710/direct/01/ > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From kander25 at cableone.net Thu Jan 14 18:38:50 2010 From: kander25 at cableone.net (kander25@cableone.net) Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2010 19:38:50 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England Message-ID: <63354.1263523130@cableone.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://eclipse.sggee.org/pipermail/ger-poland-volhynia/attachments/20100114/b7ed158c/attachment.html From wjmilner at shaw.ca Fri Jan 15 07:46:24 2010 From: wjmilner at shaw.ca (Jack Milner) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 08:46:24 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England In-Reply-To: <63354.1263523130@cableone.net> References: <63354.1263523130@cableone.net> Message-ID: <4B508DD0.1030205@shaw.ca> Here is another web site that complements the information supplied by the other site listed by Helen Gillespie: http://www.jmr.nmm.ac.uk/server/show/conJmrArticle.28 Jack Milner ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- kander25 at cableone.net wrote: > The link to the "Trains, Shelters and Ships" article is: > http://www.le.ac.uk/hi/teaching/papers/newman1.htm > > Karen > > > > On Fri Jan 15 1:47 , Helen Gillespie sent: > > Found an interesting article on emigration from Eastern Europe, > although much relates to Jewish emigration ..... > > > http://www.thebakers.ie/trains%20and%20shelters%20and%20ships.htm > > > > One branch of my Baier family emigrated from Volhynia via Riga > (the train goes there from Aleksandrija Kr. Rowno) and thence to > Liverpool before going to New York - arriving December 24 1904. > From there to Benton Harbor, MI..... And curiously the ship's > manifest listed them as the Menginger family - but all of their > first name's and ages matched my Baier family - and their sponsor > family was Menginger, so I figured the agent simplified the > process and changed their names. > > Helen > > > > --- On Fri, 1/15/10, Nelson Itterman > wrote: > >> From: Nelson Itterman > >> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England >> To: "'Brandt Gibson'" >, > ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > >> Date: Friday, January 15, 2010, 12:20 AM >> My family boarded a train in Zhitomir >> and went to Moscow then to Riga Latvia >> and a ship to London, England, then by train to Liverpool >> and a ship to St. >> John, New Brunswick. I believe this was all arranged by the >> CPR in Winnipeg. >> Nelson >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org > >> [ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org > href=>','','','')">ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org > ] >> On Behalf Of Brandt >> Gibson >> Sent: January-14-10 4:32 PM >> To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > >> Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England >> >> >> Hi all, >> >> >> >> I'm looking for some help in tracing the emigration route >> of my ancestors, >> Samuel and Pauline (Rosen) Joseph and their kids. They >> arrived in Montreal, >> Quebec on October 5, 1910 on the S.S. Tunisian, which left >> Liverpool, >> England a week or so before. I don't know when or how they >> got to England, >> and would appreciate any help anyone could offer on >> researching this. The >> only clues I have as to where they originated in Russia are >> in the Canadian >> border crossing records. In them, Sam stated he was from >> Olanuwka/Ulanowka >> or Zitomar (depending on the record). >> >> >> >> Thanks! >> >> >> >> Brandt Gibson > > > > > > > > From eduardo.kommers at gmail.com Fri Jan 15 08:42:21 2010 From: eduardo.kommers at gmail.com (Eduardo Kommers) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 14:42:21 -0200 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] passenger lists Message-ID: <01a501ca9601$b7b24dd0$0301010a@ntbrt02> Hi to everybody! Few days ago I discovered that my family left Europe through Napoli Port, Italy, not through Marseille, as I firstly thought. So, now I'm looking for this passenger list of the Napoli Port. Do you have any information where I can find passenger lists for Italy ports? Ship: LES ANDES left Napoli in Nov/1897. Thanks, Eduardo From zsorba99 at yahoo.com Fri Jan 15 09:46:57 2010 From: zsorba99 at yahoo.com (Allyn Brosz) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 12:46:57 -0500 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Emigration Through England Message-ID: > > The Merseyside Maritime Museum in Liverpool is an excellent resource for > information on travel to and from that port. You can access their web site > at http://www.liverpoolmuseums.org.uk/maritime/about.asp Also, if your ancestors came through Hamburg, the Ballinstadt museum has important information. Here's the German-language web site: http://www.ballinstadt.de/Erlebnismuseum.html They used to have an English-language version of these pages, but I can't find the link right now. Bremen also has an excellent site, the German Emigration Center: http://www.dah-bremerhaven.de/english/hauptseite_e.html Best Wishes Allyn > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Brandt Gibson > To: > Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2010 15:31:54 -0800 > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England > > Hi all, > > > > I'm looking for some help in tracing the emigration route of my ancestors, > Samuel and Pauline (Rosen) Joseph and their kids. They arrived in Montreal, > Quebec on October 5, 1910 on the S.S. Tunisian, which left Liverpool, > England a week or so before. I don't know when or how they got to England, > and would appreciate any help anyone could offer on researching this. The > only clues I have as to where they originated in Russia are in the Canadian > border crossing records. In them, Sam stated he was from Olanuwka/Ulanowka > or Zitomar (depending on the record). > > > > Thanks! > > > > Brandt Gibson > > Fife, WA > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390710/direct/01/ > > From spaghettitree at aol.com Fri Jan 15 11:16:32 2010 From: spaghettitree at aol.com (spaghettitree@aol.com) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 14:16:32 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] passenger lists Message-ID: <27260.530b5784.38821910@aol.com> Give us some names, including any variant spellings, and ages, I have a couple places to look for you - though it will be next week. (I work with books before I go into online stuff.) Maureen In a message dated 1/15/2010 9:33:34 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, eduardo.kommers at gmail.com writes: Hi to everybody! Few days ago I discovered that my family left Europe through Napoli Port, Italy, not through Marseille, as I firstly thought. So, now I'm looking for this passenger list of the Napoli Port. Do you have any information where I can find passenger lists for Italy ports? Ship: LES ANDES left Napoli in Nov/1897. Thanks, Eduardo _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From cmduff at redwing.net Fri Jan 15 11:39:35 2010 From: cmduff at redwing.net (Carol Duff) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 13:39:35 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] CPR In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B50C477.8020906@redwing.net> Nelson: Is there a record of the arrangements made by CPR for immigration? > From rakow at ifh.de Fri Jan 15 12:14:17 2010 From: rakow at ifh.de (Paul Rakow) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 21:14:17 +0100 (CET) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Brandt, The surviving British passenger lists (1890-1960) are now online, so you could (for a few $$) check what information is there. Lists I've looked at from the 20s gave some information on how the family entered Britain. The Tunisian left Liverpool for Montreal on 21 Sept 1910. (That's all I could find for free). The web site is http://www.findmypast.co.uk It might also be worth while checking the Hamburg passenger lists, as that was one of the most popular ways of getting to Britain. Paul Rakow (in Liverpool) rakow at ifh.de ----- Brandt Gibson wrote > > I'm looking for some help in tracing the emigration route of my ancestors, Samuel and Pauline (Rosen) Joseph and their kids. They arrived in Montreal, Quebec on October 5, 1910 on the S.S. Tunisian, which left Liverpool, England a week or so before. I don't know when or how they got to England, and would appreciate any help anyone could offer on researching this. The only clues I have as to where they originated in Russia are in the Canadian border crossing records. In them, Sam stated he was from Olanuwka/Ulanowka or Zitomar (depending on the record). > From kgrueneichcarey at hotmail.com Fri Jan 15 13:01:33 2010 From: kgrueneichcarey at hotmail.com (K GRUENEICHCAREY) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 13:01:33 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] GENEALOGY -- PASSENGER EMIGRATION & IMMIGRATION LISTS -- FYI Message-ID: For Eduardo & others, Have you seen this website -- it is like a reference for all kinds of lists, though I have not actually used it myself yet. http://home.att.net/~wee-monster/onlinelists.html Good luck, KMC From garynrho at gmail.com Fri Jan 15 14:04:35 2010 From: garynrho at gmail.com (rhonda simpson) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 16:04:35 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England References: Message-ID: <512077996C444E9EAC54D06CAA23FA81@yourae066c3a9b> I think we all forget about the great "free" Canadian resource for passenger lists that may take a bit more time to find, but with the info you have, you can enter the ship name, departure date and come up with the passenger list on this site http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/passenger/001045-100.01-e.php Granted, you'll have to page through many pages, but you have a head start with the information you have. A bit of a hint from experience, a lot of ships listed their passengers in a very predictable manner, British Subjects, Scandinavians, Europeans, Eastern Europeans/Russian/Slavs and Hebrew. Not all, but many. I found some of my needed passenger data by starting at the back and working forward. Oft times too, there will be separate pages for those going to the USA, sometimes at the end, that I found mostly hit and miss. Good luck Rhonda ------------------------------------------------- From: "Paul Rakow" Sent: Friday, January 15, 2010 2:14 PM To: Cc: "Brandt Gibson" Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England > > Brandt, > > The surviving British passenger lists (1890-1960) are now > online, so you could (for a few $$) check what information is there. > Lists I've looked at from the 20s gave some information on how the > family entered Britain. > > The Tunisian left Liverpool for Montreal on 21 Sept 1910. (That's > all I could find for free). > > The web site is > http://www.findmypast.co.uk > > It might also be worth while checking the Hamburg passenger > lists, as that was one of the most popular ways of getting to > Britain. > > Paul Rakow (in Liverpool) > rakow at ifh.de > > ----- > Brandt Gibson wrote >> >> I'm looking for some help in tracing the emigration route of my >> ancestors, Samuel and Pauline (Rosen) Joseph and their kids. They arrived >> in Montreal, Quebec on October 5, 1910 on the S.S. Tunisian, which left >> Liverpool, England a week or so before. I don't know when or how they got >> to England, and would appreciate any help anyone could offer on >> researching this. The only clues I have as to where they originated in >> Russia are in the Canadian border crossing records. In them, Sam stated >> he was from Olanuwka/Ulanowka or Zitomar (depending on the record). >> > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From krampetz at aol.com Fri Jan 15 15:59:17 2010 From: krampetz at aol.com (krampetz@aol.com) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 18:59:17 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Emigration Through England Message-ID: <13c5d.e072d14.38825b55@aol.com> Go to that page, click the red "Hamburg" in the upper right header, you'll get a German page with an English globe in the upper left.. Click the globe, and on the next page - listen to the ship horn, but click the picture Bob In a message dated 1/15/2010 9:49:38 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, zsorba99 at yahoo.com writes: > > The Merseyside Maritime Museum in Liverpool is an excellent resource for > information on travel to and from that port. You can access their web site > at http://www.liverpoolmuseums.org.uk/maritime/about.asp Also, if your ancestors came through Hamburg, the Ballinstadt museum has important information. Here's the German-language web site: http://www.ballinstadt.de/Erlebnismuseum.html They used to have an English-language version of these pages, but I can't find the link right now. Bremen also has an excellent site, the German Emigration Center: http://www.dah-bremerhaven.de/english/hauptseite_e.html Best Wishes Allyn > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Brandt Gibson > To: > Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2010 15:31:54 -0800 > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Migration through England > > Hi all, > > > > I'm looking for some help in tracing the emigration route of my ancestors, > Samuel and Pauline (Rosen) Joseph and their kids. They arrived in Montreal, > Quebec on October 5, 1910 on the S.S. Tunisian, which left Liverpool, > England a week or so before. I don't know when or how they got to England, > and would appreciate any help anyone could offer on researching this. The > only clues I have as to where they originated in Russia are in the Canadian > border crossing records. In them, Sam stated he was from Olanuwka/Ulanowka > or Zitomar (depending on the record). > > > > Thanks! > > > > Brandt Gibson > > Fife, WA > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390710/direct/01/ > > _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From colnels at telus.net Fri Jan 15 18:57:05 2010 From: colnels at telus.net (Nelson Itterman) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 19:57:05 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] CPR In-Reply-To: <4B50C477.8020906@redwing.net> References: <4B50C477.8020906@redwing.net> Message-ID: <001101ca9657$971fb840$c55f28c0$@net> Hello Carol: I really have no knowledge of how it was done. I do know that my Uncle Jonathon made arrangements and paid our passage from Zhitomir to Winnipeg sometime in 1926 with the Canadian Pacific Railway. They may have information in their archives, if they could be found. Nelson -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Carol Duff Sent: January-15-10 12:40 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] CPR Nelson: Is there a record of the arrangements made by CPR for immigration? > _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From rlyster at telusplanet.net Fri Jan 15 20:28:29 2010 From: rlyster at telusplanet.net (Rita Lyster) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 21:28:29 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] CPR Message-ID: <27599756.5882063.1263616109491.JavaMail.nitido@priv-edtnes94> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://eclipse.sggee.org/pipermail/ger-poland-volhynia/attachments/20100115/0ed7741a/attachment.html From colnels at telus.net Fri Jan 15 20:57:01 2010 From: colnels at telus.net (Nelson Itterman) Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 21:57:01 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] CPR In-Reply-To: <27599756.5882063.1263616109491.JavaMail.nitido@priv-edtnes94> References: <27599756.5882063.1263616109491.JavaMail.nitido@priv-edtnes94> Message-ID: <001b01ca9668$57791a40$066b4ec0$@net> Hi Rita: Just goes to show that there was some truth in what I said about my Uncle Jonathon arranging passage for our family to come from Zhitomir to Winnipeg. Thanks a bunch for the information. Nelson From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Rita Lyster Sent: January-15-10 9:28 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] CPR My grandfather saved a brochure from CPR. It advertised the open west country for settlement and cheap land. It was from about that era and written in Polish. CPR had agents in Russia looking for immigration. He had other letters where the CPR worked with immigration to try to get the rest of his family over. This was big business for them, to keep their ships and railroad busy. When the rest of my family members came, granddad paid in advance to CPR. After my Dad came, he got a small refund for overpayment....he still kept the receipt! Rita On Jan 15, 2010, Nelson Itterman wrote: Hello Carol: I really have no knowledge of how it was done. I do know that my Uncle Jonathon made arrangements and paid our passage from Zhitomir to Winnipeg sometime in 1926 with the Canadian Pacific Railway. They may have information in their archives, if they could be found. Nelson -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Carol Duff Sent: January-15-10 12:40 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] CPR Nelson: Is there a record of the arrangements made by CPR for immigration? > _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From gpvjem at sasktel.net Sat Jan 16 05:24:02 2010 From: gpvjem at sasktel.net (gpvjem) Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 07:24:02 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] CPR References: <27599756.5882063.1263616109491.JavaMail.nitido@priv-edtnes94> Message-ID: <7A3FDE0CB9E14406BAB9C7B0629A1291@Marsh> Canadian Pacific agents operated in many overseas locations. Immigrants were often sold a package that included passage on a CP ship, travel on a CP train, and land sold by the CP railway. Land was priced at $2.50 an acre and up. CPR land could also be purchased by established settlers if desired and often was well into the 1920s. Records of CPR land purchases are held by the Glenbow Museum in Calgary, Alberta and are searchable at http://www.glenbow.org/collections/archives/ John Marsch ------------------------------------------------------------------ My grandfather saved a brochure from CPR. It advertised the open west country for settlement and cheap land. It was from about that era and written in Polish. CPR had agents in Russia looking for immigration. He had other letters where the CPR worked with immigration to try to get the rest of his family over. This was big business for them, to keep their ships and railroad busy. When the rest of my family members came, granddad paid in advance to CPR. After my Dad came, he got a small refund for overpayment....he still kept the receipt! Rita On Jan 15, 2010, Nelson Itterman wrote: Hello Carol: I really have no knowledge of how it was done. I do know that my Uncle Jonathon made arrangements and paid our passage from Zhitomir to Winnipeg sometime in 1926 with the Canadian Pacific Railway. They may have information in their archives, if they could be found. Nelson -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Carol Duff Sent: January-15-10 12:40 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] CPR Nelson: Is there a record of the arrangements made by CPR for immigration? > From Earl.Schultz at telusplanet.net Sun Jan 17 14:17:06 2010 From: Earl.Schultz at telusplanet.net (Earl.Schultz) Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2010 15:17:06 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Kaminski and Sebroski from Rypin In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <003c01ca97c2$ce203fb0$6a60bf10$@Schultz@telusplanet.net> Hal, I'm doing the Rypin/Michalki extractions for SGGEE and I do have a lot of Kaminskis in my database. However, before these extractions can help you, you have to have these lines back to 1865 or earlier unless someone has submitted their GEDCOM with later information or you go through the Polish or EZAB Archives to obtain your information. Please contact me off-line for more discussion. I will be travelling for the next few days but I will see how I can help you after that. Earl ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 20:24:01 -0500 From: Hal and Jan Kamm Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Kaminski and Sebroski from Rypin To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Message-ID: <8A1051C1-67C2-4AF5-AE1A-BAB711D4CA13 at charter.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I have been researching my paternal grandparents and think that Ludwig and Arthur Kaminski came from Rypin and/or Plock in 1900 for Ludwig, 1907 for Arthur, and my grandmother Mary Sebroski (orZabroski) came in 1889. Ludwig and Arthur's parents were John Kaminski and Louisa Brinkmann or Brickmann. Mary's parents were John Sebroski and mother was Sophie ?Kommroske. Other close family friends from Rypin were Krupps (Otto, Ottilie, Henry, Oscar, Leopold, Helen) whose father was Emil Krupp, mother was Natalie. Also Otto Neske who came from Rypin about 1902. I joined SGGEE recently and have not found anything on this site that sheds light on these families. What other resources are available through SGGEE? Thanks Hal Kamm ------------------------------ From lmpauling at utech.net Mon Jan 18 10:16:40 2010 From: lmpauling at utech.net (Linda Marks Pauling) Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 10:16:40 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Renovation of Osowka by Sierpc EV. Cemetery Message-ID: <1BA2D16907B3477A8A43505CC4CD5527@LINDASTOY> I invite you to the page www.osowka.republika.pl - on the site are new updates, and translations into German and English! You are welcome! Greetings! Tomasz For those of you who are interested in the village of Osowka by Sierpc, I share this invitation from Tomasz, the high school student in Sierpc, who has this last year spearheaded the renovation of the Evangelical cemetery there. Tomasz has updated this site and it is now possible to read it in English and German as well as Polish. There are many wonderful pictures as well as a history of the village and the cemetery, and I think you will be amazed at what these students have so lovingly done! He is now planning for the renovation of the Evangelical cemeteries in Bialasy and Czartownia. If any of you have information about residents of these villages or pictures you can share with Tomasz, I know he would be grateful. THANK YOU, TOMASZ and FRIENDS! Linda Marks Pauling From dproper at charter.net Wed Jan 20 23:33:20 2010 From: dproper at charter.net (Dave Proper) Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2010 23:33:20 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Schmidt location? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: All, My wife's 2nd great grandmother, Dorothea __?__ was married to Michael Strefling when she died in Volhynia. The Volhynia 1860's Death file has an entry for her like this: Last, First Name D/M Year Place Parents/Spouse Strefling, Dorothea 26 Jun 1867 Shitomir husband Michael Film/It Pge Reg Remarks 1884090/2 536 62 born Schmidt 44 yr Looking at other entries in the file, the "born Schmidt" would mean that she was born in a place named "Schmidt" in 1823. So where would that be? There is no place by that name in the Volhynia Gazetteer - does anyone have any idea where it might be referring to? Also, the place of death: most of the places seem to refer to a parish name and yet there are other places seem to refer to actual places??? Thanks! Dave Proper From kopetzke at gmx.net Thu Jan 21 02:09:27 2010 From: kopetzke at gmx.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Irene_K=F6nig?=) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 11:09:27 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Schmidt location? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B5827D7.1010408@gmx.net> > Looking at other entries in the file, the "born Schmidt" would mean > that she was born in a place named "Schmidt" in 1823. So where would > that be? There is no place by that name in the Volhynia Gazetteer - > does anyone have any idea where it might be referring to? Dave, The truth is in the actual church records. They can be viewed online through the Pilot Project of familysearch.org http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/#start Click on "Browse our record collection", then click on Europe on the map, then on "Russia Lutheran Church Book Duplicates", then scroll down to Volyn --> Zhitomir --> Shitomir: Shitomir --> 1867: Births, marriages, deaths (828-14/151) --> View 48 Images --> Image 38 of 48 There you'll find the following: gestorben (died): 1867, 26 Juny, 2 Uhr morgens (a.m.) begraben (buried): 28 Juny nachmittags (in the afternoon) Dorothea Strefling, geb. (born) Schmidt, Ehefrau des Kolonisten (spouse of colonist) Michael Strefling aus Polen (born in Poland) 44 Jahre (44 years old) Todesursache: Wassersucht (cause of death: dropsy) beerdigt auf dem luth. Kirchhofe zu Friedensdorf von Kirchenschullehrer Heinrich Behrend (burial in the Lutheran Cemetery of Friedensdorf by Heinrich Behrend, schoolteacher [of the church]) -- Irene K?nig From LINDASUSAK at comcast.net Thu Jan 21 05:46:11 2010 From: LINDASUSAK at comcast.net (LINDASUSAK@comcast.net) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 13:46:11 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region In-Reply-To: <4B4B52B5.4050305@warnerengineering.com> Message-ID: <349303342.12555281264081571826.JavaMail.root@sz0079a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Does anyone know to which church district (Kirchspiel) a place named Kamienica would have belonged? Kamienica lies between Wroclawek and Plock, near Karwosieki, Glowina and Dobrzyn nad Wisla. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Warner" To: "Jerry Frank" Cc: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 9:32:53 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region To all, We have the Heinrich Johann Hertes family from Plock in our Master Pedigree database. Three of the children marry into Fercho, and Richert families. Since this data is also in the SGGEE001 file, I expect that the records that we have are more numerous than just this one family. I will contact Roland separately. Gary Warner On 1/11/2010 6:26 AM, Jerry Frank wrote: > The following message was posted from Germany. The poster is not a > subscriber so please respond personally if you can help. His email > address is: > > roland.hertes at t-online.de > > Hello, > > My family lived in Poland around 1800 to 1845 in the region of Plock. > One of the HERTES families migrated from Poland to the USA and Canada. > I seek information about the following families. > > Buchholtz > Ferchau > Hertes > Richert > > With friendly greetings, > > Roland Hertes > > ---------------------------------------------------- > > > Hallo, > > meine Familie war von etwa 1800 - 1945 in Polen wohnhaft, und zwar > haupts?chlich im Raum Plock. > Einige Angeh?rige der Familie HERTES sind von Polen aus nach USA und > Canada ausgewandert. > > Ich suche Informationen ?ber folgende Familien: > > BUCHHOLTZ > FERCHAU, > HERTES > RICHERT > > Mit freundlichen Gr??en > Roland (Hertes) > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca Thu Jan 21 05:48:54 2010 From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca (Jerry Frank) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 06:48:54 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Schmidt location? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B585B46.5040302@shaw.ca> Just to clarify Irene's comment further, "geboren (or geb.) Schmidt" translated from German = born Schmidt = nee Schmidt. It is not reference to a place name. Jerry Frank Calgary, AB Dave Proper wrote: > All, > My wife's 2nd great grandmother, Dorothea __?__ was married to Michael > Strefling when she died > in Volhynia. The Volhynia 1860's Death file has an entry for her like this: > > Last, First Name D/M Year Place > Parents/Spouse > Strefling, Dorothea 26 Jun 1867 Shitomir > husband Michael > > Film/It Pge Reg Remarks > 1884090/2 536 62 born Schmidt 44 yr > > Looking at other entries in the file, the "born Schmidt" would mean that she > was born in a > place named "Schmidt" in 1823. So where would that be? There is no place by > that name in the > Volhynia Gazetteer - does anyone have any idea where it might be referring > to? > > Also, the place of death: most of the places seem to refer to a parish name > and yet there are > other places seem to refer to actual places??? > > Thanks! > Dave Proper > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > From edieadam at gmail.com Thu Jan 21 06:11:41 2010 From: edieadam at gmail.com (Edie Adam) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:11:41 -0500 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Village: Alt Schlawe? Message-ID: Hello list: Is anyone familiar with a place, presumably in Volhynia, called Alt Schlawe? At least that what it looks like in the New York passenger list. Any suggestions for location or alternate spellings appreciated. Thank you. Edie Adam From spaghettitree at aol.com Thu Jan 21 06:18:04 2010 From: spaghettitree at aol.com (spaghettitree@aol.com) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:18:04 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Schmidt location? Message-ID: <44ee.102e7f5b.3889bc1c@aol.com> I think the "born Schmidt" indicates that Dorothea Strefling was born as Dorothea Schmidt, her maiden name, in this context. Tried to send this 2 hours ago, but the storms apparently prevented access - AOL never tells you why. Maureen In a message dated 1/21/2010 2:13:33 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, kopetzke at gmx.net writes: > Looking at other entries in the file, the "born Schmidt" would mean > that she was born in a place named "Schmidt" in 1823. So where would > that be? There is no place by that name in the Volhynia Gazetteer - > does anyone have any idea where it might be referring to? Dave, The truth is in the actual church records. They can be viewed online through the Pilot Project of familysearch.org http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/#start Click on "Browse our record collection", then click on Europe on the map, then on "Russia Lutheran Church Book Duplicates", then scroll down to Volyn --> Zhitomir --> Shitomir: Shitomir --> 1867: Births, marriages, deaths (828-14/151) --> View 48 Images --> Image 38 of 48 There you'll find the following: gestorben (died): 1867, 26 Juny, 2 Uhr morgens (a.m.) begraben (buried): 28 Juny nachmittags (in the afternoon) Dorothea Strefling, geb. (born) Schmidt, Ehefrau des Kolonisten (spouse of colonist) Michael Strefling aus Polen (born in Poland) 44 Jahre (44 years old) Todesursache: Wassersucht (cause of death: dropsy) beerdigt auf dem luth. Kirchhofe zu Friedensdorf von Kirchenschullehrer Heinrich Behrend (burial in the Lutheran Cemetery of Friedensdorf by Heinrich Behrend, schoolteacher [of the church]) -- Irene K?nig _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From spaghettitree at aol.com Thu Jan 21 06:33:14 2010 From: spaghettitree at aol.com (spaghettitree@aol.com) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:33:14 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Village: Alt Schlawe? Message-ID: <4b43.78cc8544.3889bfaa@aol.com> Meyers-Orts (1912 gazetteer), shows an Alt Schlawe, as a Dorf (village) on the Wipper, Pruessen, Pommern, government district K?slin, kreis, court district and military district of F Schlawe Pommern, east 4 kilometers from Koccejendorf; 887 residents, post office with telephone and telegraph, Standesamt, district government office, Evangelische Pfarramt, Molk (dairy), a mill, and a brick factory. Maureen Schoenky In a message dated 1/21/2010 6:20:11 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, edieadam at gmail.com writes: Hello list: Is anyone familiar with a place, presumably in Volhynia, called Alt Schlawe? At least that what it looks like in the New York passenger list. Any suggestions for location or alternate spellings appreciated. Thank you. Edie Adam _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From albertmuth at aol.com Thu Jan 21 07:21:53 2010 From: albertmuth at aol.com (albertmuth@aol.com) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 10:21:53 -0500 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family/Plock region; Kamienica parish identifier In-Reply-To: <349303342.12555281264081571826.JavaMail.root@sz0079a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <8CC68C497830486-2454-4CA0@webmail-d061.sysops.aol.com> What time frame are you interested in? The answer for 1820 is not the same as 1880 or 1930. Almost anywhere in Russian Poland, the early 1840's can mark a change (even if the dead end of your paper trail did not already tell you so). Before this time, you may need to examine records in Catholic parishes. For the area you are describing--which I assume refers to the North side of the Wisla river, even though Wloclawek is on the South side--if in the Dobrzyn parish, remember that records are filmed only to 1865. You would need to contact the Polish State Archives for anyting later. Per the online Slownik http://dir.icm.edu.pl/pl/Slownik_geograficzny/Tom_III/743 (the one you want is in the left column, #4), Kamienica is in the parish of Sobowo. The LDS church has filmed records for the Catholic church in this area. The stetlseeker website http://www.jewishgen.org/Communities/LocTown.asp tells me that Sobowo is only 3.5 miles East of Dobrzyn nad Wisla, the closest Lutheran parish. Hope this helps. Al Muth -----Original Message----- From: LINDASUSAK at comcast.net To: Gary Warner Cc: Jerry Frank ; ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Thu, Jan 21, 2010 8:46 am Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region Does anyone know to which church district (Kirchspiel) a place named Kamienica would have belonged? Kamienica lies between Wroclawek and Plock, near Karwosieki, Glowina and Dobrzyn nad Wisla. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Warner" To: "Jerry Frank" Cc: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 9:32:53 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family search in Plock region To all, We have the Heinrich Johann Hertes family from Plock in our Master Pedigree database. Three of the children marry into Fercho, and Richert families. Since this data is also in the SGGEE001 file, I expect that the records that we have are more numerous than just this one family. I will contact Roland separately. Gary Warner On 1/11/2010 6:26 AM, Jerry Frank wrote: > The following message was posted from Germany. The poster is not a > subscriber so please respond personally if you can help. His email > address is: > > roland.hertes at t-online.de > > Hello, > > My family lived in Poland around 1800 to 1845 in the region of Plock. > One of the HERTES families migrated from Poland to the USA and Canada. > I seek information about the following families. > > Buchholtz > Ferchau > Hertes > Richert > > With friendly greetings, > > Roland Hertes > > ---------------------------------------------------- > > > Hallo, > > meine Familie war von etwa 1800 - 1945 in Polen wohnhaft, und zwar > haupts?chlich im Raum Plock. > Einige Angeh?rige der Familie HERTES sind von Polen aus nach USA und > Canada ausgewandert. > > Ich suche Informationen ?ber folgende Familien: > > BUCHHOLTZ > FERCHAU, > HERTES > RICHERT > > Mit freundlichen Gr??en > Roland (Hertes) > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv _______________________________________________Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted bySociety for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.orgMailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From colnels at telus.net Thu Jan 21 07:53:59 2010 From: colnels at telus.net (Nelson Itterman) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 08:53:59 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Schmidt location? In-Reply-To: <4B5827D7.1010408@gmx.net> References: <4B5827D7.1010408@gmx.net> Message-ID: <000901ca9ab1$f2a8d440$d7fa7cc0$@net> Or does it mean that her birth name was Schmidt? Nelson -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Irene K?nig Sent: January-21-10 3:09 AM To: Dave Proper Cc: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Schmidt location? > Looking at other entries in the file, the "born Schmidt" would mean > that she was born in a place named "Schmidt" in 1823. So where would > that be? There is no place by that name in the Volhynia Gazetteer - > does anyone have any idea where it might be referring to? Dave, The truth is in the actual church records. They can be viewed online through the Pilot Project of familysearch.org http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/#start Click on "Browse our record collection", then click on Europe on the map, then on "Russia Lutheran Church Book Duplicates", then scroll down to Volyn --> Zhitomir --> Shitomir: Shitomir --> 1867: Births, marriages, deaths (828-14/151) --> View 48 Images --> Image 38 of 48 There you'll find the following: gestorben (died): 1867, 26 Juny, 2 Uhr morgens (a.m.) begraben (buried): 28 Juny nachmittags (in the afternoon) Dorothea Strefling, geb. (born) Schmidt, Ehefrau des Kolonisten (spouse of colonist) Michael Strefling aus Polen (born in Poland) 44 Jahre (44 years old) Todesursache: Wassersucht (cause of death: dropsy) beerdigt auf dem luth. Kirchhofe zu Friedensdorf von Kirchenschullehrer Heinrich Behrend (burial in the Lutheran Cemetery of Friedensdorf by Heinrich Behrend, schoolteacher [of the church]) -- Irene K?nig _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From kander25 at cableone.net Thu Jan 21 10:39:00 2010 From: kander25 at cableone.net (kander25@cableone.net) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 11:39:00 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Village: Alt Schlawe? Message-ID: <63771.1264099140@cableone.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://eclipse.sggee.org/pipermail/ger-poland-volhynia/attachments/20100121/51b27247/attachment.html From krampetz at aol.com Thu Jan 21 18:48:08 2010 From: krampetz at aol.com (krampetz@aol.com) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 21:48:08 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Schmidt location? Message-ID: <1a690.3484652e.388a6be8@aol.com> If that's a translation from "nee", the French word meaning "Born as", that would be her maiden name.. Bob In a message dated 01/20/10 11:32:42 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, dproper at charter.net writes: All, My wife's 2nd great grandmother, Dorothea __?__ was married to Michael Strefling when she died in Volhynia. The Volhynia 1860's Death file has an entry for her like this: Last, First Name D/M Year Place Parents/Spouse Strefling, Dorothea 26 Jun 1867 Shitomir husband Michael Film/It Pge Reg Remarks 1884090/2 536 62 born Schmidt 44 yr Looking at other entries in the file, the "born Schmidt" would mean that she was born in a place named "Schmidt" in 1823. So where would that be? There is no place by that name in the Volhynia Gazetteer - does anyone have any idea where it might be referring to? Also, the place of death: most of the places seem to refer to a parish name and yet there are other places seem to refer to actual places??? Thanks! Dave Proper _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From dproper at charter.net Thu Jan 21 18:58:00 2010 From: dproper at charter.net (Dave Proper) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 18:58:00 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Schmidt location? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: All, Thank you for all of your help and input with my Schmidt "location" question. A special thanks to Irene K?nig for showing me how to see the original images via the Family Search pilot site, it is a fantastic help. I guess that I am definitely ahead of where I was before, now that I know that Dorothea Schmidt was born in Poland in 1823. On the downside there is no clue as to "where" in Poland and that her surname is like the proverbial "Smith" in the New York City phone book. Some progress is better than none at all! Dave Proper From pnswork at aol.com Thu Jan 21 23:30:27 2010 From: pnswork at aol.com (pnswork@aol.com) Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 02:30:27 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Schmidt location? Message-ID: <1ee6a.61baa05a.388aae13@aol.com> Hi Dave, Try to find out where the husband (Michael Strefling) was born. Very likely, it was the same area as Dorothea. I have a few Schmidts in my family tree in Poland, but none of them match up with your Dorothea. If you can find a marriage record for Michael (second marriage after Dorothea passed away), that might give his birthplace. Men didn't tend to stay widowers very long in those days. They needed someone to look after all the children and run the house. Good luck! -Paul In a message dated 1/21/2010 6:58:08 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, dproper at charter.net writes: All, Thank you for all of your help and input with my Schmidt "location" question. A special thanks to Irene K?nig for showing me how to see the original images via the Family Search pilot site, it is a fantastic help. I guess that I am definitely ahead of where I was before, now that I know that Dorothea Schmidt was born in Poland in 1823. On the downside there is no clue as to "where" in Poland and that her surname is like the proverbial "Smith" in the New York City phone book. Some progress is better than none at all! Dave Proper _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From doncarolea at aol.com Fri Jan 22 02:09:02 2010 From: doncarolea at aol.com (doncarolea@aol.com) Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 05:09:02 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] German Bureau of Aryan Records Message-ID: <722.2563be03.388ad33e@aol.com> My uncle, Otto Stebner, was born in Volhynia between 1893 and 1896 somewhere near Zhytomir. The family, consisting of my mother, her parents, her sister and 5 brothers, left Volhynia in about 1908 and went to Bismarkwald near Gross Wartenberg. All emigrated to the US in 1914 except for Otto. Otto fought in the German army in WW1 against the Russians, including the battle of Tannenberg. In 1938, he was the proprietor of a soft goods store in Koslin, Pomerania known as "August Stebner & Co." August Stebner must have been a relative. Otto wrote his brother in Chicago asking him if he knew the names and birth places of their grandparents as this information was being requested by the German Bureau of Aryan records. His brother did not know but Otto must have found the information somehow. Does anyone know if this information can be accessed? I am really searching for the birth place of my grandfather, Heinrich Stebner, and the names and birth places of his parents. Also, the birth place of my grandmother, Julianna Schmuland, and her parents, Gottfried Schmuland and Justine Pischle. These families were German Lutheran. Don Anderson From colnels at telus.net Fri Jan 22 07:01:25 2010 From: colnels at telus.net (Nelson Itterman) Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 08:01:25 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] German Bureau of Aryan Records In-Reply-To: <722.2563be03.388ad33e@aol.com> References: <722.2563be03.388ad33e@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001ca9b73$c51fa450$4f5eecf0$@net> Hello Don: I think you should look in the St. Petersburg Lutheran records on the Odessa site. There is a Heinrich Stebner's marriage to Juliane Schnneland ( I think it should read Schmuland) 25 Jan 1882. There is also birth of Emilie Schmunland 24 Dec 1868 to Gottfried Schmuland and Justine Pischle. Nelson -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of doncarolea at aol.com Sent: January-22-10 3:09 AM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] German Bureau of Aryan Records My uncle, Otto Stebner, was born in Volhynia between 1893 and 1896 somewhere near Zhytomir. The family, consisting of my mother, her parents, her sister and 5 brothers, left Volhynia in about 1908 and went to Bismarkwald near Gross Wartenberg. All emigrated to the US in 1914 except for Otto. Otto fought in the German army in WW1 against the Russians, including the battle of Tannenberg. In 1938, he was the proprietor of a soft goods store in Koslin, Pomerania known as "August Stebner & Co." August Stebner must have been a relative. Otto wrote his brother in Chicago asking him if he knew the names and birth places of their grandparents as this information was being requested by the German Bureau of Aryan records. His brother did not know but Otto must have found the information somehow. Does anyone know if this information can be accessed? I am really searching for the birth place of my grandfather, Heinrich Stebner, and the names and birth places of his parents. Also, the birth place of my grandmother, Julianna Schmuland, and her parents, Gottfried Schmuland and Justine Pischle. These families were German Lutheran. Don Anderson _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From nancygertner at mac.com Fri Jan 22 08:36:20 2010 From: nancygertner at mac.com (Nancy Gertner) Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 10:36:20 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] German Bureau of Aryan Records; Pischle, Schmuland records in 'Odessa files' online In-Reply-To: <722.2563be03.388ad33e@aol.com> References: <722.2563be03.388ad33e@aol.com> Message-ID: Don: IF the 'Aryan Records' information was requested during WWII era, it's possible you may find it in the 'EWZ Records.' This is a microfilm collection held at the U.S. National Archives annex in College Park Maryland. The EWZ records are written in German. When I visited the annex a few years ago, I was able to find some records searching on my surnames. After you find the name, you'll get the EWZ number, which is like: 912 318 They you look at a different microfilm, and find that EWZ record for the papers on the applicant, which may include a photo about the size of a current driver's license photo. The papers can show the applicant's birthdate, spouse, children, parents, grandparents. The page labeled "Feststellung der Deutschstaemmigkeit" is the one that includes the grandparents. Some of the boxes on this family tree page may be blank if the applicant did not know the names of all the ancestors of their spouse and self. With Facebook as a tool, I have recently made contact with cousins in Germany descended from the siblings of my immigrant ancestor's 'left behind' relatives. - - - - The birth information of your ancestors may be in some records if the events were 1885 or earlier. Have you tried looking in the 'Odessa Files?' at this website: http://www.odessa3.org/search.html using the surnames as Query String and select 'St. Petersburg' as Data Category. (These are Lutheran Church records.) There are some Schmuland birth records I find when using that criteria, but not with the parents you cite. You may need to use wild cards in the search to check alternate spellings. When I use Pischle for the query string, this is the only 'hit' I get: For the query, pischle, of category St. Petersburg File: 1,409,969 Volhynian Births, 1870-75 (M. Momose) Schmuland, Emilie 24 Dec 1868 Gruenthal Gottfried Pischle , Justine 1884113/1 163 4 So you may need to use wild card searches here too; or perhaps the birth occurred outside the years covered by the data base. (I think this is a record of a christening that occurred during years 1870-75, and the child was apparently born in 1868.) Using Stebner, Heinrich, as the query string yields this search result: For the query, stebner, heinrich, of category St. Petersburg File: 535,164 Volhynian Marriages, 1880-85 (M. Momose) Stebner, Heinrich 25 Jan 1882 Heimtal Parish Schnneland, Juliane 1897596/1 974 14 [this indicates the person that did the record transcription, M. Momose, interpreted the name as SchNNEland instead of Schmuland.] 1882 as year of marriage indicates the bride and groom were probably born before 1870. IF you go and view the microfilm of this marriage record at you LDS Family History Center, you may find it contains additional info, like the names of parents, and birthplace of the groom and bride. It's also possible that the families were not living in Volhynia at the times of the births of Heinrich and Juliane. Emilie may have been the youngest child and the only one christened in Volhynia. Nancy in Minnesota On Jan 22, 2010, at 4:09 AM, doncarolea at aol.com wrote: > My uncle, Otto Stebner, was born in Volhynia between 1893 and 1896 > somewhere near Zhytomir. Otto wrote his brother in Chicago > asking him if he knew > the names and birth places of their grandparents as this > information was > being requested by the German Bureau of Aryan records. His > brother did not > know but Otto must have found the information somehow. Does > anyone know if > this information can be accessed? > > I am really searching for the birth place of my grandfather, Heinrich > Stebner, and the names and birth places of his parents. Also, the > birth place > of my grandmother, Julianna Schmuland, and her parents, Gottfried > Schmuland > and Justine Pischle. These families were German Lutheran. > > Don Anderson > From dnmiller at whiz.to Fri Jan 22 09:17:28 2010 From: dnmiller at whiz.to (Don Miller) Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 09:17:28 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Dates for the 2010 Volhynian Village Adventure Tour Message-ID: <002501ca9b86$c6715700$6901a8c0@DonMiller> VOLHYNIAN VILLAGE ADVENTURE TOUR We are now taking registrations for the 2010 Volhynian Village Adventure Tour. The dates are August 8-19, 2010. For more information and registration, go to my website at www.volhynia.org and click on "Tours." The tour group is limited to 10, first come, first served. Thanks. Don Miller Tour Escort From lklarenbach at shaw.ca Fri Jan 22 10:33:35 2010 From: lklarenbach at shaw.ca (Lois Klarenbach) Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 11:33:35 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Pachal search Message-ID: <2F2F13AB-49CC-458B-9055-C29291443136@shaw.ca> Would anyone be able to tell me were the area is? Sometime ago I discovered this site and never acted on it, concerning my Grandfather Rudolph Pachal from the International Geealogical Index/CE. FamilySearch.org - Search Gender: Male Birth:06 Dec 1869 Radom, Kieleckiego, Poland I only know that my Grandmother Anna Schmidt came from this area of Radom but the Kieleckiego stumps me. Any help would be appreciated. Lois Klarenbach From roseingram at shaw.ca Fri Jan 22 11:03:12 2010 From: roseingram at shaw.ca (Rose Ingram) Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 11:03:12 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Pachal search References: <2F2F13AB-49CC-458B-9055-C29291443136@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <00bb01ca9b95$8b647750$6601a8c0@duocore> Lois The following link may be of help to you. http://www.jewishgen.org/krsig/articles/GeographicHistory.htm I believe the description on the IGI follows the SPIS Gazetteer. Radom being in Kielce province. Rose Ingram ----- Original Message ----- From: Lois Klarenbach To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 10:33 AM Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Pachal search Would anyone be able to tell me were the area is? Sometime ago I discovered this site and never acted on it, concerning my Grandfather Rudolph Pachal from the International Geealogical Index/CE. FamilySearch.org - Search Gender: Male Birth:06 Dec 1869 Radom, Kieleckiego, Poland I only know that my Grandmother Anna Schmidt came from this area of Radom but the Kieleckiego stumps me. Any help would be appreciated. Lois Klarenbach _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From momdotts at aol.com Fri Jan 22 16:29:29 2010 From: momdotts at aol.com (momdotts@aol.com) Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 19:29:29 EST Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] EWZ Question Message-ID: <1858a.59d4addb.388b9ce9@aol.com> I believe I have found my grandfather's first wife. I unfortunately do not know how to locate a EWZ film. Could someone advise which film the information would be found. Thanks so much in advance. Barbara Last, First D/M Year Birth Place Film Frame Remarks Pallas, Mathilde 31 Mar 1887 Neuborn A3342EWZ50G016 0970 geb. Seemann From daveobee at shaw.ca Fri Jan 22 16:51:51 2010 From: daveobee at shaw.ca (Dave Obee) Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 16:51:51 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] EWZ Question In-Reply-To: <1858a.59d4addb.388b9ce9@aol.com> References: <1858a.59d4addb.388b9ce9@aol.com> Message-ID: Film G016 in the EWZ50 series, page 970 (out of 3,000, more or less) If you have not looked at it already, you might want to go to www.volhynia.com where I have some info on EWZ. Dave Obee ----- Original Message ----- From: momdotts at aol.com Date: Friday, January 22, 2010 16:32 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] EWZ Question To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > I believe I have found my grandfather's first wife.? I > unfortunately? do > not know how to locate a EWZ film.? Could someone advise > which film the? > information would be found. > ? > Thanks so much in advance. > ? > Barbara > ? > ? > Last,? > First???????????????????? D/M?? Year Birth? Place??????????????????? > ???????????? Film?????????? Frame Remarks > Pallas, Mathilde????? 31 Mar 1887 > Neuborn??????? A3342EWZ50G016 > 0970? geb. > Seemann > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From nancygertner at mac.com Fri Jan 22 17:31:29 2010 From: nancygertner at mac.com (Nancy Gertner) Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 19:31:29 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] EWZ Question In-Reply-To: <1858a.59d4addb.388b9ce9@aol.com> References: <1858a.59d4addb.388b9ce9@aol.com> Message-ID: <05D245E3-CF94-45C3-B8E0-A6BB8A87FBC2@mac.com> I think you need to look in the EWZ index to find the EWZ file number so you know which microfilm to look at for the application pages of the EWZ record. The EWZ records are in the National Archives Annex in College Park, Maryland. Nancy On Jan 22, 2010, at 6:29 PM, momdotts at aol.com wrote: > I believe I have found my grandfather's first wife. I > unfortunately do > not know how to locate a EWZ film. Could someone advise which film > the > information would be found. > > Thanks so much in advance. > > Barbara > > > Last, First D/M Year Birth Place > Film Frame Remarks > Pallas, Mathilde 31 Mar 1887 Neuborn A3342EWZ50G016 > 0970 geb. > Seemann > From Earl.Schultz at telusplanet.net Sat Jan 23 13:37:01 2010 From: Earl.Schultz at telusplanet.net (Earl.Schultz) Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 14:37:01 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Schmidt location? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000901ca9c74$333fd080$99bf7180$@Schultz@telusplanet.net> Dave, Yes, Schmidt is very common and will make it difficult to find the right person but Dorothea is not as common. At least it is not Anna or Ludwika. I can tell you that she does NOT appear in the Michalki/Rypin records. Earl ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 18:58:00 -0800 From: "Dave Proper" Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Schmidt location? To: Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" All, Thank you for all of your help and input with my Schmidt "location" question. A special thanks to Irene K?nig for showing me how to see the original images via the Family Search pilot site, it is a fantastic help. I guess that I am definitely ahead of where I was before, now that I know that Dorothea Schmidt was born in Poland in 1823. On the downside there is no clue as to "where" in Poland and that her surname is like the proverbial "Smith" in the New York City phone book. Some progress is better than none at all! Dave Proper ------------------------------ From family at kerntopf.com Sat Jan 23 17:21:33 2010 From: family at kerntopf.com (Uwe Kerntopf) Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 02:21:33 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Zufallsfund TOBER aus Wielki Message-ID: <4B5BA09D.8030502@kerntopf.com> Hallo, aus den Registraturen der Stadt Byt?w 1947 (B?tow, Kreis B?tow, Pommern) TOBER, Ferdynand * 12.05.1898 Wielkie, Kr. Lipno Eltern: Jan & Elzbieta geb. STOLKE lebte 1947 Zamkowa G?ra powiat Byt?w Ciao Uwe -- - Uwe Kerntopf, L?lsdorf, Germany http://www.kerntopf.com - - Arbeitskreis Heimat- und Familienforschung Stolper Lande - - im Verein Stolper Heimatkreise e.V. http://www.stolp.de - - Mailingliste Stolp-L http://wiki-de.genealogy.net/Stolp-L - From jjstange at gmail.com Mon Jan 25 11:45:17 2010 From: jjstange at gmail.com (Jim Stange) Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2010 14:45:17 -0500 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Looking for Records near Kiev Message-ID: <77f14bdd1001251145h7825957ft2e02aedc2c778abb@mail.gmail.com> Hello - I am hoping to locate a birth record in the Ukraine. This relative later moved to Wloclawek and his daughter's birth record gives the following clues to his birth place: *...Prokop Ilin* (son of Ilin?) *Niepoczatenko, 37* (he would have been born about 1875)* years, soldier Regiment of Wloclawek, originate from farmers of Gouvernement Kiev, County Human, Commune Podwysokie, Village Podwysokie....* ** I am not at all familiar with research in Ukrainian Orthodox records and do not know where to begin. I think the county may be Uman in Ukraine and Human in Polish... Any help is very much appreciated! From dproper at charter.net Mon Jan 25 18:29:39 2010 From: dproper at charter.net (dproper@charter.net) Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2010 18:29:39 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Location of "Schmidt" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20100125212939.ZWISQ.199065.root@mp16> Earl, Thanks for responding! Both Michael Strefling and his wife Dorothea Schmidt are a cipher to me. I have to find any trace of them back in Poland, yet! Dave Proper From gary at warnerengineering.com Mon Jan 25 19:09:17 2010 From: gary at warnerengineering.com (Gary Warner) Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2010 19:09:17 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Location of "Schmidt" In-Reply-To: <20100125212939.ZWISQ.199065.root@mp16> References: <20100125212939.ZWISQ.199065.root@mp16> Message-ID: <4B5E5CDD.7040005@warnerengineering.com> Dave, As I look at your data in the MPD, it appears that your success hinges on finding where the son of Michael (who was Karl or Charlie) was born. Since Charlie died in the USA, you should be able to find a petition for naturalization, assuming that he became a US citizen. That petition will show where he was born. Do you know if Charlie had any siblings? If you are going to find the correct family, it will help immensely if you can find other children of your Michael and Dorothea. Have you tried looking for any area histories where Charlie settled in Wisconsin? Gary Warner On 1/25/2010 6:29 PM, dproper at charter.net wrote: > Earl, > Thanks for responding! Both Michael Strefling and his wife Dorothea Schmidt are a cipher to me. I have to find any trace of them back in Poland, yet! > Dave Proper > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From rakow at ifh.de Tue Jan 26 12:39:04 2010 From: rakow at ifh.de (Paul Rakow) Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 21:39:04 +0100 (CET) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] German Bureau of Aryan Records In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Don, This sounds like the "Aryan Pass", a document which most Germans filled out during the Nazi period, listing their ancestors. Unfortunately, the government didn't keep copies, the only way of getting hold of this document is if a member of the German Stebner family held on to it. Volhynia Germans who had been in Germany since 1908 wouldn't have EWZ files - those were only for people who came to Germany during the War years. But it might still be worth looking for Stebners, Schmulands and Pischles in the EWZ films, because there might have been more distant relatives of yours who only came to Germany in the early 40s. Do you know the web-site http://pommerndatenbank.de They have transcribed a lot of address books from Pomerania, there are two Stebners listed in Koeslin in 1937, August Stebner and Otto Stebner. Stebner & Co, Manufactured goods and clothing, the home of good quality and cheap prices I think it would be fun to get a copy of their advert from the 1937 Koeslin city address book. Paul Rakow rakow at ifh.de ==================== doncarolea at aol.com wrote: > > My uncle, Otto Stebner, was born in Volhynia between 1893 and 1896 > somewhere near Zhytomir. The family, consisting of my mother, her parents, her > sister and 5 brothers, left Volhynia in about 1908 and went to Bismarkwald > near Gross Wartenberg. All emigrated to the US in 1914 except for Otto. > Otto fought in the German army in WW1 against the Russians, including the > battle of Tannenberg. In 1938, he was the proprietor of a soft goods store in > Koslin, Pomerania known as "August Stebner & Co." August Stebner must have > been a relative. Otto wrote his brother in Chicago asking him if he knew > the names and birth places of their grandparents as this information was > being requested by the German Bureau of Aryan records. His brother did not > know but Otto must have found the information somehow. Does anyone know if > this information can be accessed? > > I am really searching for the birth place of my grandfather, Heinrich > Stebner, and the names and birth places of his parents. Also, the birth place > of my grandmother, Julianna Schmuland, and her parents, Gottfried Schmuland > and Justine Pischle. These families were German Lutheran. > > Don Anderson > From colnels at telus.net Tue Jan 26 15:26:34 2010 From: colnels at telus.net (Nelson Itterman) Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 16:26:34 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] German Bureau of Aryan Records In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000101ca9edf$0059ef30$010dcd90$@net> Hello Don & Paul: If you go to the Odessa site you will find: Daughter Emelie born 02 1872 in Grunthal to Gottfriel Schmuland and Justine Pischle - also Heinrich Stebner's marriage to Julianne Schnneland - 25 Jan 1882. I think that should probably be Schmuland. In addition to the St. Petersburg files you could look at the War Records. Nelson -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Paul Rakow Sent: January-26-10 1:39 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] German Bureau of Aryan Records Don, This sounds like the "Aryan Pass", a document which most Germans filled out during the Nazi period, listing their ancestors. Unfortunately, the government didn't keep copies, the only way of getting hold of this document is if a member of the German Stebner family held on to it. Volhynia Germans who had been in Germany since 1908 wouldn't have EWZ files - those were only for people who came to Germany during the War years. But it might still be worth looking for Stebners, Schmulands and Pischles in the EWZ films, because there might have been more distant relatives of yours who only came to Germany in the early 40s. Do you know the web-site http://pommerndatenbank.de They have transcribed a lot of address books from Pomerania, there are two Stebners listed in Koeslin in 1937, August Stebner and Otto Stebner. Stebner & Co, Manufactured goods and clothing, the home of good quality and cheap prices I think it would be fun to get a copy of their advert from the 1937 Koeslin city address book. Paul Rakow rakow at ifh.de ==================== doncarolea at aol.com wrote: > > My uncle, Otto Stebner, was born in Volhynia between 1893 and 1896 > somewhere near Zhytomir. The family, consisting of my mother, her parents, her > sister and 5 brothers, left Volhynia in about 1908 and went to Bismarkwald > near Gross Wartenberg. All emigrated to the US in 1914 except for Otto. > Otto fought in the German army in WW1 against the Russians, including the > battle of Tannenberg. In 1938, he was the proprietor of a soft goods store in > Koslin, Pomerania known as "August Stebner & Co." August Stebner must have > been a relative. Otto wrote his brother in Chicago asking him if he knew > the names and birth places of their grandparents as this information was > being requested by the German Bureau of Aryan records. His brother did not > know but Otto must have found the information somehow. Does anyone know if > this information can be accessed? > > I am really searching for the birth place of my grandfather, Heinrich > Stebner, and the names and birth places of his parents. Also, the birth place > of my grandmother, Julianna Schmuland, and her parents, Gottfried Schmuland > and Justine Pischle. These families were German Lutheran. > > Don Anderson > _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From hgillespie at rogers.com Tue Jan 26 15:29:24 2010 From: hgillespie at rogers.com (Helen Gillespie) Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 15:29:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] German Bureau of Aryan Records In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <687493.83065.qm@web88004.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I know of a Schmalandt family who live in the Chicago area. They came to the US ca. 1951 or 1952. They were from Volhynia and were friends of my parents - Lydia Schmalandt nee Skalee was my Mom's maid of honour. My Mom told me that some of the family had changed their names - but do not know if they ever kept in touch. I do know that one of the daughters-in-law is interested in family history and I had sent some info that I had found over the years, but we have not kept in touch. I am sure you'd find their names on the internet. By the way, IKEA - the international corporation - began in southern Sweden in Sm?land - not a far cry from Schmalandt or Schmuland - and the sound is the same. Some info I found was that they had come from Sweden in an earlier century. Helen --- On Tue, 1/26/10, Paul Rakow wrote: > From: Paul Rakow > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] German Bureau of Aryan Records > To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Date: Tuesday, January 26, 2010, 8:39 PM > > ???Don, > > ? ? ???This sounds like the "Aryan > Pass", a document which most > ? Germans filled out during the Nazi period, listing > their ancestors. > ? Unfortunately, the government didn't keep copies, > the only way of > ? getting hold of this document is if a member of the > German Stebner > ? family held on to it. > > ? ? ???Volhynia Germans who had > been in Germany since 1908 wouldn't > ? have EWZ files - those were only for people who came > to Germany during > ? the War years. But it might still be worth looking > for Stebners, > ? Schmulands and Pischles in the EWZ films, because > there might have > ? been more distant relatives of yours who only came > to Germany > ? in the early 40s. > > ? ? ???Do you know the web-site > ? http://pommerndatenbank.de > > ? ? ???They have transcribed a lot > of address books from Pomerania, > ? there are two Stebners listed in Koeslin in 1937, > ? ???August Stebner and Otto Stebner. > > ???Stebner & Co, > ???Manufactured goods and clothing, > ???the home of good quality > ???and cheap prices > > ? ? ? I think it would be fun to get a copy > of their advert from > ? the 1937 Koeslin city address book. > > ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Paul > Rakow > ? ? ? ? ? ? ? rakow at ifh.de > > ==================== > > ? doncarolea at aol.com > wrote: > > > > My uncle, Otto Stebner, was born in Volhynia between > 1893 and 1896 > > somewhere near Zhytomir.? The family, consisting > of my mother, her parents,? her > > sister and 5 brothers, left Volhynia in about 1908 and > went to? Bismarkwald > > near Gross Wartenberg.? All emigrated to the US > in 1914? except for Otto. > > Otto fought in the German army in WW1 against > the? Russians, including the > > battle of Tannenberg.? In 1938, he was the? > proprietor of a soft goods store in > > Koslin, Pomerania known as "August Stebner? & > Co."? August Stebner must have > > been a relative. Otto wrote his? brother in > Chicago asking him if he knew > > the names and birth places of their? grandparents > as this information was > > being requested by the German Bureau of? Aryan > records.? His brother did not > > know but Otto must have found the? information > somehow.? Does anyone know if > > this information can be? accessed? > > > > I am really searching for the birth place of my > grandfather, Heinrich > > Stebner, and the names and birth places of his > parents. Also, the? birth place > > of my grandmother, Julianna Schmuland, and her > parents, Gottfried? Schmuland > > and Justine Pischle.? These families were German > Lutheran. > > > > Don Anderson > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From Birgit.jenning at web.de Wed Jan 27 03:50:26 2010 From: Birgit.jenning at web.de (Birgit) Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 12:50:26 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Search for ancestors settled 1821 in Wincentowo in the Pultusk area Message-ID: Hello, my ancestors were German settlers of evang.-augsburg. confession and lived 1821 near the river Narew in Wincentowo and surrounding area. Unfortunately the Protestant parish register of births at the Pultusk archive starts at 1843. My question: Where should I search for my ancestors born in 1821? In the Roman Catholic church register for Pultusk? In the civil registration for Pultusk? Or in the Roman Catholic church register of Obryte which is closer to Wincentowo than Pultusk? Thank you for your help. Birgit Jenning From LINDASUSAK at comcast.net Wed Jan 27 05:29:04 2010 From: LINDASUSAK at comcast.net (LINDASUSAK@comcast.net) Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 13:29:04 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Search for ancestors settled 1821 in Wincentowo in the Pultusk area In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <968396235.14905681264598944387.JavaMail.root@sz0079a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Dear Birgit I don't know if I told you this before or not, but some of my ancestors' records are from Pultusk, some from Praschnitz (in German); relatives didn't know why, so you might try there. The Polish name for the town is similar to the German, but without any vowels! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Birgit" To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 2010 4:50:26 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Search for ancestors settled 1821 in Wincentowo in the Pultusk area Hello, my ancestors were German settlers of evang.-augsburg. confession and lived 1821 near the river Narew in Wincentowo and surrounding area. Unfortunately the Protestant parish register of births at the Pultusk archive starts at 1843. My question: Where should I search for my ancestors born in 1821? In the Roman Catholic church register for Pultusk? In the civil registration for Pultusk? Or in the Roman Catholic church register of Obryte which is closer to Wincentowo than Pultusk? Thank you for your help. Birgit Jenning _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From nancygertner at mac.com Wed Jan 27 05:46:55 2010 From: nancygertner at mac.com (Nancy Gertner) Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 07:46:55 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Search for ancestors settled 1821 Wincentowo, Pultusk area; try familysearch.org In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Birgit, you don't mention the surnames. Perhaps the ancestors attended another Augsbug Confession Church further away before 1843. I found my ancestors in the Revier parish in the 1840s, and in Schokken Parish before that. Posen Province, Kreis Wongrowitz. Have you tried searching for the surnames on www.familysearch.org? That might give you a clue in which archives to look for their records. Nancy On Jan 27, 2010, at 5:50 AM, Birgit wrote: > Hello, > my ancestors were German settlers of evang.-augsburg. confession > and lived > 1821 near the river Narew in Wincentowo and surrounding area. > Unfortunately the Protestant parish register of births at the Pultusk > archive starts at 1843. > My question: Where should I search for my ancestors born in 1821? > In the > Roman Catholic church register for Pultusk? In the civil > registration for > Pultusk? Or in the Roman Catholic church register of Obryte which is > closer to Wincentowo than Pultusk? Thank you for your help. > Birgit Jenning From Birgit.jenning at web.de Wed Jan 27 05:55:07 2010 From: Birgit.jenning at web.de (Birgit) Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 14:55:07 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Search for ancestors settled 1821 Wincentowo, Pultusk area; try familysearch.org In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Nancy, my ancestors name were Luise Sokolowski(born 1821 in Wincentowo, daughter of Heinrich Sokolowski and Marianne Mozan) and Efraim Kr?ger(born 1835 in Wincentowo, son of Heinrich Kr?ger and Helene Barke). Birgit From otto at schienke.com Wed Jan 27 11:41:52 2010 From: otto at schienke.com (Otto) Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 14:41:52 -0500 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Search for ancestors settled 1821 in Wincentowo in the Pultusk area In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1D51AD75-81B9-423F-AE03-9A6BD5C50604@schienke.com> Afternoon Birgit, For your time period mentioned I would first try the RC Pultusk records (Pultusk was a Prussian garrison city)- Found some of mine there (evang-augs). Pultusk relatives were also recorded in the Ilow parish at the same time. Next try the other RC parish. Praschnitz and Nasielsk are of a later time period. On Jan 27, 2010, at 6:50 AM, Birgit wrote: > Hello, > my ancestors were German settlers of evang.-augsburg. confession and > lived > 1821 near the river Narew in Wincentowo and surrounding area. > Unfortunately the Protestant parish register of births at the Pultusk > archive starts at 1843. > My question: Where should I search for my ancestors born in 1821? In > the > Roman Catholic church register for Pultusk? In the civil > registration for > Pultusk? Or in the Roman Catholic church register of Obryte which is > closer to Wincentowo than Pultusk? Thank you for your help. > Birgit Jenning > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv . . . Otto " The Zen moment..." wk. of January 01, 2010- _____________________________________ "Satisfaction . . . lurks in the answers." From gary at warnerengineering.com Wed Jan 27 11:50:44 2010 From: gary at warnerengineering.com (Gary Warner) Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 11:50:44 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Search for ancestors settled 1821 in Wincentowo in the Pultusk area In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B609914.9020406@warnerengineering.com> Birgit, According to the book "Polish Localities in the Russian Partition and Their Parish Affiliationns, Vol. 1, Bialystok, Lomza Plock Dioceses", Wincentowo was located in the Plock diocese, and the Catholic parish for that village was Lubiel to the northeast of that village. If I take that parish name and look on www.familysearch.org, I see that there are films for that parish from 1799 to 1902. Be aware that even though your family was evangelical, their events may still be recorded in the Catholic parish after the formation of the Evangelical parish. In rare cases, you may find events recorded in both the Catholic and Evangelical parishes. The link to the films in Lubiel is http://www.familysearch.org/eng/library/fhlcatalog/supermainframeset.asp?display=titlefilmnotes&columns=*%2C0%2C0&titleno=672035&disp=Kopie+ksi%C4%99g+metrykalnych++ Even though Lubiel is the designated Catholic parish for Wincentowo, that village appears to be about the same distance from the Catholich parishes of Sokolowo to the northwest, and Porzadzie to the south, so you might also find records for your family in those parish records. Gary Warner On 1/27/2010 3:50 AM, Birgit wrote: > Hello, > my ancestors were German settlers of evang.-augsburg. confession and lived > 1821 near the river Narew in Wincentowo and surrounding area. > Unfortunately the Protestant parish register of births at the Pultusk > archive starts at 1843. > My question: Where should I search for my ancestors born in 1821? In the > Roman Catholic church register for Pultusk? In the civil registration for > Pultusk? Or in the Roman Catholic church register of Obryte which is > closer to Wincentowo than Pultusk? Thank you for your help. > Birgit Jenning > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From Family.Erdmann at t-online.de Wed Jan 27 14:39:45 2010 From: Family.Erdmann at t-online.de (Gaby und Bernd Erdmann) Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 17:39:45 -0500 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family GROSS from Lublin area Message-ID: <620334C5D6B44DB0828532541272EAAF@DELLOFFICE> Hello, I am trying to trace back the family of Michael Gross and Anna Rosina Schinkel. Here the facts I have collected so far (thanks especially to the Lublin translation team): Michael Gross * ~1836 place ??? Anna Rosina Schinkel 1839 (may be Nov. 1839 Nowosolna) Marriage date and place unknown Children: Samuel Gross * 17.11.1863 Stasiew, Lublin (15km south-west of Opole Lubelskie, 5 km east of river vistula) Karolina Gross * 1867 Stasiew, Lublin Christoph Gross * 1868 Stasiew, Lublin Emilia Gross * 30.04. 1871 Skordiow, (Chelm area) Juliues * 16.01.1979 Helenow, Wolhynien Mathilde * 17.12. 1881 Helenow, Wolhynien Here some of the questions: Birth of Anna Rosina Schinkel in 1839 in Nowosolna is confirmed but the marriage certificate is missing therefore I am not clear whether she is really the spouse of Michael Gross but name and date of birth match exactly. As disks related to marriages for the years 1856-1864 from the Lublin area have already been published I am assuming that the couple must have been move to the Lublin district after they got married. I was not able to find Stasiew in one of the SGGEE scanned maps, nor is it shown on the Lublin church district map. According to the certificate of baptism the colony of Stasiew belonged to the district of Walowice. The only Walowice, which I could find is close by (east) the vistula river. The place Stasiew (Stasin) and the second location listed above, Skordiow do represent quiet a distance to Lublin. Stasiew to Lublin is about 90km and from Skordiow to Lublin would be more than 60 km given the infrastructure at that time this must have been kind of an adventure to get there, for the baptism of a child. I am also interested in the marriage of Gustav Gross and Wilhelmine Engel in 1879, Nov 6th, Rozyszcze. Who are the parents of Gustav Gross and what is the place he was born, in case someone is just reading the film no. 2380026. Gustav might be another son of Michael Gross and Anna Rosina Schinkel. Thanks for any help Bernd From perry1121 at aol.com Wed Jan 27 16:34:06 2010 From: perry1121 at aol.com (Sigrid Pohl Perry) Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 18:34:06 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Family GROSS from Lublin area In-Reply-To: <620334C5D6B44DB0828532541272EAAF@DELLOFFICE> References: <620334C5D6B44DB0828532541272EAAF@DELLOFFICE> Message-ID: <4B60DB7E.8040003@aol.com> Hello Bernd, I can't help you with finding the marriage record for Michael Gross and Anna Rosine Schinkel, but you might find the following comments helpful. First, yes Stasiew/Staszow/Staszew is most likely an early version in Polish or Russian for Stasin on later maps. Various records for the 1860s-1880s describe it as being in Gmina Swieciechow in Janow in the Lublin Gubernia, or as you say also in the Walowice parish district. There is a Stasin which fits this description on a map you can download: http://www.mapywig.org/m/WIG100_300DPI/P45_S34_KRASNIK_300dpi.jpg You will find Swieciechow along the western edge of the map by the Wisla River; you'll notice that that northwest edge also includes a bit of Walowice. Stasin is northeast of Swieciechow near Pielgrzymka and Miloszowka, two other villages whose residents regularly reported to Lublin for baptisms, marriages and deaths. Yes, I know it is a far distance to go, but it was the Evangelical church in the region at this time. You will find Walowice on this map's northeast corner: http://www.mapywig.org/m/WIG100_300DPI/A45_B33_OPATOW_300dpi.jpg You will notice that the detailed birth/baptism record for Samuel Gross shows Jan 1865 in the Lublin index, but Nov 1864 from another disk which consists of "compilation tables." The volunteers use the prominent date in the record for the index; that is the baptism month and year; the day of birth is buried in the text of the detailed record, so it is possible he was born in Nov 1864 and baptised in Jan 1865. The table gives the names and the date with no information about godparents. You'd have to look at the record(s) to see the actual dates and other information. The volunteers can't provide that in an index. Other possibilities for information: the Lublin Team still has records to index from 1872-1878 before your Gross family appears in Volhynia. If an older child dies during these years, a birthplace outside of the Lublin area may be noted in the record. Also, you should examine who the witnesses are on these records. They are usually family members or very close friends. You might find more information on records related to those people and see where they came from. In this way, you build on the family relationships. I hope this information is helpful. I am one of the Lublin Project volunteers. You may email me privately if you have other questions. Regards, Sigrid Pohl Perry On 1/27/2010 4:39 PM, Gaby und Bernd Erdmann wrote: > Hello, > > > > I am trying to trace back the family of Michael Gross and Anna Rosina Schinkel. Here the facts I have collected so far (thanks especially to the Lublin translation team): > > > > Michael Gross * ~1836 place ??? > > Anna Rosina Schinkel 1839 (may be Nov. 1839 Nowosolna) > > Marriage date and place unknown > > > > Children: > > > > Samuel Gross * 17.11.1863 Stasiew, Lublin (15km south-west of Opole Lubelskie, 5 km east of river vistula) > > Karolina Gross * 1867 Stasiew, Lublin > > Christoph Gross * 1868 Stasiew, Lublin > > Emilia Gross * 30.04. 1871 Skordiow, (Chelm area) > > Juliues * 16.01.1979 Helenow, Wolhynien > > Mathilde * 17.12. 1881 Helenow, Wolhynien > > > > Here some of the questions: > > Birth of Anna Rosina Schinkel in 1839 in Nowosolna is confirmed but the marriage certificate is missing therefore I am not clear whether she is really the spouse of Michael Gross but name and date of birth match exactly. As disks related to marriages for the years 1856-1864 from the Lublin area have already been published I am assuming that the couple must have been move to the Lublin district after they got married. > > > > I was not able to find Stasiew in one of the SGGEE scanned maps, nor is it shown on the Lublin church district map. According to the certificate of baptism the colony of Stasiew belonged to the district of Walowice. The only Walowice, which I could find is close by (east) the vistula river. The place Stasiew (Stasin) and the second location listed above, Skordiow do represent quiet a distance to Lublin. Stasiew to Lublin is about 90km and from Skordiow to Lublin would be more than 60 km given the infrastructure at that time this must have been kind of an adventure to get there, for the baptism of a child. > > > > I am also interested in the marriage of Gustav Gross and Wilhelmine Engel in 1879, Nov 6th, Rozyszcze. Who are the parents of Gustav Gross and what is the place he was born, in case someone is just reading the film no. 2380026. Gustav might be another son of Michael Gross and Anna Rosina Schinkel. > > > > Thanks for any help > > > > Bernd > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From Earl.Schultz at telusplanet.net Thu Jan 28 09:24:15 2010 From: Earl.Schultz at telusplanet.net (Earl.Schultz) Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2010 10:24:15 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Search for ancestors settled 1821 in Wincentowo in the Pultusk area In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001201caa03e$b8c69900$2a53cb00$@Schultz@telusplanet.net> Birgit, the mention by Gary of the Plock diocese caught my attention and I checked the records for Michalki/Rypin parish. There are three Sokolowski families in this parish in the 1830s/1840s, Adam, Johann, and Martin, plus the deaths of some earlier family members back to about 1817 (Michael). The family disappears from this area about 1844. While not the families you are looking for, they may still be relatives and clues to where they came from may be in the records. Many families in this area came from Thorn originally, sometimes passing through Lipno. This may help break down the brick wall someday if the advice of others doesn't help you. Earl ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 11:50:44 -0800 From: Gary Warner Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Search for ancestors settled 1821 in Wincentowo in the Pultusk area To: Birgit Cc: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Message-ID: <4B609914.9020406 at warnerengineering.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Birgit, According to the book "Polish Localities in the Russian Partition and Their Parish Affiliationns, Vol. 1, Bialystok, Lomza Plock Dioceses", Wincentowo was located in the Plock diocese, and the Catholic parish for that village was Lubiel to the northeast of that village. If I take that parish name and look on www.familysearch.org, I see that there are films for that parish from 1799 to 1902. Be aware that even though your family was evangelical, their events may still be recorded in the Catholic parish after the formation of the Evangelical parish. In rare cases, you may find events recorded in both the Catholic and Evangelical parishes. The link to the films in Lubiel is http://www.familysearch.org/eng/library/fhlcatalog/supermainframeset.asp?dis play=titlefilmnotes&columns=*%2C0%2C0&titleno=672035&disp=Kopie+ksi%C4%99g+m etrykalnych++ Even though Lubiel is the designated Catholic parish for Wincentowo, that village appears to be about the same distance from the Catholich parishes of Sokolowo to the northwest, and Porzadzie to the south, so you might also find records for your family in those parish records. Gary Warner On 1/27/2010 3:50 AM, Birgit wrote: > Hello, > my ancestors were German settlers of evang.-augsburg. confession and lived > 1821 near the river Narew in Wincentowo and surrounding area. > Unfortunately the Protestant parish register of births at the Pultusk > archive starts at 1843. > My question: Where should I search for my ancestors born in 1821? In the > Roman Catholic church register for Pultusk? In the civil registration for > Pultusk? Or in the Roman Catholic church register of Obryte which is > closer to Wincentowo than Pultusk? Thank you for your help. > Birgit Jenning > From reiner at miericke.net Thu Jan 28 13:29:07 2010 From: reiner at miericke.net (Reiner Miericke) Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2010 22:29:07 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] =?iso-8859-1?q?Searchig_for_=22Scherfer=22_?= =?iso-8859-1?q?or_=22_Sch=E4rfer_=22?= Message-ID: <201001282229.08077.reiner@miericke.net> Hello since I am new to this mailing list (and to genealogy as well) I hopefully am allowed to ask some stupid questions: 1: scanning the mail archive I only found oone mail concerning family "Scherfer" (Uta H?rtling, may 2005). She lists the family names for Glombie near Lodz. ... Hekiendorf (= Eichendorff?), Johann & Marianna Oztrzenska (= Scherfer?) ... Oztrzynski (= Scherfer?), Christian & Anna Rosa Frank Oztrzynski (= Scherfer?), Carl & Rosalia Krankowska ... Does this mean that some famlies have two different names at the same time? 2. There is some hint to a "Pilot Project" http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/#start where I can get the original images to parish registers. Did this page vanish? 3. I read that all registers for volhynia are availabe through ODESSA. But this seems not to be the case since there are huge gaps in the list of availabe year (the each decade). Did I misunderstand something? 4. My first step will be to find some information about a persone named Julius Scherfer which was born in Galowek about 1830-1850. Is there a way get the images of the according registers? Or do you advice me some other approach? Thanks in advance! From ra_stein at telus.net Thu Jan 28 14:47:07 2010 From: ra_stein at telus.net (Richard Stein) Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2010 15:47:07 -0700 Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_=5BGer-Poland-Volhynia=5D_Searchig_for_=22Scherfer=22_?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?or_=22_Sch=E4rfer_=22?= In-Reply-To: <201001282229.08077.reiner@miericke.net> References: <201001282229.08077.reiner@miericke.net> Message-ID: <8ABC7C8E9BF74C149AC17CDBC91AD593@RichardPC> Hi Reiner, I can try to answer your questions. Probably other people on the list will be able to add further answers. 1. In the Polish records, the names of Germans were often recorded as their Polish equivalents. It appears that the Polish name Oztrzynski may have the same meaning as the German name Scherfer. So you will have to be on the lookout for both forms. 2. The family search site is still there. Browse the locations to find Russia, and then Russian Lutheran records. These are images of the Lutheran records held in St. Petersburg Archive. They do not include Lutherans in Poland. 3. The St. Petersburg Archive records have been indexed and appear on the Odessa site. You are right in that some years are missing and they cover only until the end of 1885. 4. I can't help you with Julius Scherfer. A quick look at SGGEE databases yields only a few Scherfer / Schaefer names around Lodz, Poland, and a few names from the 1880's in Rozyszcze parish in Volhynia. I hope this helps a little. Dick Stein ----- Original Message ----- From: "Reiner Miericke" To: Sent: Thursday, January 28, 2010 2:29 PM Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Searchig for "Scherfer" or " Sch?rfer " Hello since I am new to this mailing list (and to genealogy as well) I hopefully am allowed to ask some stupid questions: 1: scanning the mail archive I only found oone mail concerning family "Scherfer" (Uta H?rtling, may 2005). She lists the family names for Glombie near Lodz. ... Hekiendorf (= Eichendorff?), Johann & Marianna Oztrzenska (= Scherfer?) ... Oztrzynski (= Scherfer?), Christian & Anna Rosa Frank Oztrzynski (= Scherfer?), Carl & Rosalia Krankowska ... Does this mean that some famlies have two different names at the same time? 2. There is some hint to a "Pilot Project" http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/#start where I can get the original images to parish registers. Did this page vanish? 3. I read that all registers for volhynia are availabe through ODESSA. But this seems not to be the case since there are huge gaps in the list of availabe year (the each decade). Did I misunderstand something? 4. My first step will be to find some information about a persone named Julius Scherfer which was born in Galowek about 1830-1850. Is there a way get the images of the according registers? Or do you advice me some other approach? Thanks in advance! _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From brackman at telus.net Thu Jan 28 17:04:05 2010 From: brackman at telus.net (David Brackman) Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2010 17:04:05 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] russian germans Schneider Message-ID: <3728B216AB3643399AB16F298D374E31@DavidLaptop> Hello: can anyone assist with good sources of records for russian Germans, my Grandmother: Juliane Schneider was born in Alexanderdorf Russia in 1887 and emigrated to Canada in 1901. many thanks David Brackman From my_ancestors at telus.net Thu Jan 28 19:21:06 2010 From: my_ancestors at telus.net (my_ancestors) Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2010 20:21:06 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Location Message-ID: <4373EDDA49A24B93B082680FDFE15F91@studyoct21> I have a census document from 1880 I obtained from the Zhitomir archives, that provides some information about Christof Johann Tiede. Opposite his name, there is the entry as follows. "In the Petrokvskaya Gubernia Grezinskogo Uyezda of gl... Mrog according to leave service evidence from the 7th of May 1880 #4264". I believe this tells of his origin prior to coming to Volhynia in 1880. In other documents the location is referred to as the "Polish Kingdom" Would you have any information about this location? Thanks Dwayne http://sites.google.com/site/dmtfamilyhistory/ From GARY.RUPPERT at comcast.net Fri Jan 29 00:46:43 2010 From: GARY.RUPPERT at comcast.net (GARY.RUPPERT@comcast.net) Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 08:46:43 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Ger-Poland-Volhynia Digest, Vol 79, Issue 11 In-Reply-To: <1540822170.1061241264754687950.JavaMail.root@sz0029a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <1214727607.1061291264754803047.JavaMail.root@sz0029a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> searching for heimat of the Welder famiy in Ruspolen caroline geb. to amalie und unbekant Vater about 1855 married AugustS chmidt circa 1875possibly same v illage family is evangelischeemigrated1892to baltimore, Maryland all suggestions welcomed thank you Gary BALTIMORE,Maryland Baltimore ----- Original Message ----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-request at eclipse.sggee.org To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Sent: Monday, December 21, 2009 3:00:04 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Ger-Poland-Volhynia Digest, Vol 79, Issue 11 Send Ger-Poland-Volhynia mailing list submissions to ????????ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit ????????http://eclipse.sggee.org/mailman/listinfo/ger-poland-volhynia or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ????????ger-poland-volhynia-request at eclipse.sggee.org You can reach the person managing the list at ????????ger-poland-volhynia-owner at eclipse.sggee.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Ger-Poland-Volhynia digest..." Today's Topics: ?? 1. Re: naming patterns (MIKE MCHENRY) ?? 2. Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near Beruany? (Elly Huhle) ?? 3. Re: Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near Beruany? (joepessarra) ?? 4. Re: Wars was:Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near????????Beruany? ?? ? ?(krampetz at aol.com) ?? 5. Re: Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near Beruany? (joepessarra) ?? 6. Re: Wars was:Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje????????near????????Beruany? ?? ? ?(joepessarra) ?? 7. Re: naming patterns (John Bettger) ?? 8. Re: Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near Beruany? (G?nther B?hm) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 20 Dec 2009 16:14:51 -0500 From: "MIKE MCHENRY" Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] naming patterns To: "'Bill Fife'" , "'Robin Grube'" ????????,???????? Message-ID: <000001ca81b9$7862bc70$69283550$@net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii My mother had 5 siblings. Only one had a middle name Oskar Albert. He always went by Albert. Is there a saint named Oskar. ? ? MIKE -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Bill Fife Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 12:26 PM To: Robin Grube; ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] naming patterns The March 2003 SGGEE Journal has a good article on naming conventions. Bill Fife ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Grube" To: Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 10:15 PM Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] naming patterns > Hi everyone- > Besides the continuation of given names within generations of a family, > don't forget the influence of the given names of the godparents! > Robin Grube > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 20 Dec 2009 20:55:52 -0500 From: "Elly Huhle" Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near ????????Beruany? To: Message-ID: <40F59586A8A2476BB01CF61E164D412E at Elly> Content-Type: text/plain;????????charset="iso-8859-1" Hello, my name is Elly, I live in Canada and are searching for my Polish ancestors. I have a copy of a church record (marriage) from 1834 entered in the Kath. Church in Lhuta, Czech Republic (formerly Bohemia). It is stated in this record that the groom is from Russian Poland, a small place called Dunaj or Dunaje near ?Beruany or Breczany or Breyany. The writing is very bad and on top of it are the places written different in several documents. Todate I was not able to locate this place and hope that perhaps someone from the mailing list has heard of it. The name of my ancestor is Stepan Mazurkiewicz born in the year 1794. In a seperate document dated also in 1834 referring to my above mentioned ancestor and his upcoming marriage (located in the archive of the parish of Libice) is written, ?that the groom is from Russian Poland and has agreed to stay in Libice, Bohemia once the war has ended. Would anyone know what war was going on at that time? At this point I have exhausted my resources including maps, Google and ShtetlSeeker and hope that one of the members has heard of such a place. Many thanks Elly Huhle ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 20 Dec 2009 21:08:23 -0600 From: "joepessarra" Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near ????????Beruany? To: Message-ID: <000301ca81ea$db574360$9205ca20$@net> Content-Type: text/plain;????????charset="us-ascii" ShtetlSeeker has two listings for Dunaj, one is in Poland, 230.6 miles WSW of Warszawa, the other in Poland 57.2 miles NNW of Warszawa. For Beruany/, there is a Barany which is 89.9 miles ENE of the second Dunaj above. For Breczany, I could not find a match. For Breyany, I could not find a match. Sorry, not a lot of help, but a possibility. Is it possible to send a copy of the paperwork directly to me? ?Someone else on the list server might be able to help you also, if they can look at the paperwork. There was a war called the Polish Revolt, but this was about from 1830-1831. Probably not the one referred to in the paperwork. Good luck. Joe in Texas -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Elly Huhle Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 7:56 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near Beruany? Hello, my name is Elly, I live in Canada and are searching for my Polish ancestors. I have a copy of a church record (marriage) from 1834 entered in the Kath. Church in Lhuta, Czech Republic (formerly Bohemia). It is stated in this record that the groom is from Russian Poland, a small place called Dunaj or Dunaje near ?Beruany or Breczany or Breyany. The writing is very bad and on top of it are the places written different in several documents. Todate I was not able to locate this place and hope that perhaps someone from the mailing list has heard of it. The name of my ancestor is Stepan Mazurkiewicz born in the year 1794. In a seperate document dated also in 1834 referring to my above mentioned ancestor and his upcoming marriage (located in the archive of the parish of Libice) is written, ?that the groom is from Russian Poland and has agreed to stay in Libice, Bohemia once the war has ended. Would anyone know what war was going on at that time? At this point I have exhausted my resources including maps, Google and ShtetlSeeker and hope that one of the members has heard of such a place. Many thanks Elly Huhle _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 20 Dec 2009 22:30:47 EST From: krampetz at aol.com Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Wars was:Ortssuche - Dunaj or ????????Dunaje near????????Beruany? To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Message-ID: <1540d.16529fcb.386045e7 at aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Is there a list of all the "wars" or uprisings in the Polish ?partitions? Bob ? ? In a message dated 12/20/2009 7:10:38 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, ? joepessarra at suddenlink.net writes: There ?was a war called the Polish Revolt, but this was about from ? 1830-1831. Probably not the one referred to in the ?paperwork. ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 20 Dec 2009 21:36:25 -0600 From: "joepessarra" Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near ????????Beruany? To: Message-ID: <000f01ca81ee$c5e047d0$51a0d770$@net> Content-Type: text/plain;????????charset="us-ascii" Here is a site you might go to for information about the Mazurkiewicz surname. ?http://mazurkiewicz.com/index2.html Joe in Texas -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Elly Huhle Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 7:56 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near Beruany? Hello, my name is Elly, I live in Canada and are searching for my Polish ancestors. I have a copy of a church record (marriage) from 1834 entered in the Kath. Church in Lhuta, Czech Republic (formerly Bohemia). It is stated in this record that the groom is from Russian Poland, a small place called Dunaj or Dunaje near ?Beruany or Breczany or Breyany. The writing is very bad and on top of it are the places written different in several documents. Todate I was not able to locate this place and hope that perhaps someone from the mailing list has heard of it. The name of my ancestor is Stepan Mazurkiewicz born in the year 1794. In a seperate document dated also in 1834 referring to my above mentioned ancestor and his upcoming marriage (located in the archive of the parish of Libice) is written, ?that the groom is from Russian Poland and has agreed to stay in Libice, Bohemia once the war has ended. Would anyone know what war was going on at that time? At this point I have exhausted my resources including maps, Google and ShtetlSeeker and hope that one of the members has heard of such a place. Many thanks Elly Huhle _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 20 Dec 2009 21:43:28 -0600 From: "joepessarra" Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Wars was:Ortssuche - Dunaj or ????????Dunaje????????near????????Beruany? To: Message-ID: <001001ca81ef$c24bb9f0$46e32dd0$@net> Content-Type: text/plain;????????charset="us-ascii" Bob, Here is one site that has a listing of wars by country, date, region, and type. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars Hope that helps. Joe in Texas -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of krampetz at aol.com Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 9:31 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Wars was:Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near Beruany? Is there a list of all the "wars" or uprisings in the Polish ?partitions? Bob ? ? In a message dated 12/20/2009 7:10:38 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, ? joepessarra at suddenlink.net writes: There ?was a war called the Polish Revolt, but this was about from ? 1830-1831. Probably not the one referred to in the ?paperwork. _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Mon, 21 Dec 2009 09:50:42 -0500 From: John Bettger Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] naming patterns To: F&RM Haddad , ????????"ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org" ???????? Message-ID: ???????? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" There is a German book on the subject titled "dtv-Atlas, Namenkunde, Vor-und Familiennamen im deutschen Sprachgebiet"" Best Regards John Leon Bettger email address ?ceo at ametric.com Researching Waterloo South Russia (Stavki Ukraine) Odessa (city) South Russia (Odessa Ukraine) at 67 Ekaterininskaya Square (at the top of Potemkin Steps) Slowik (near Lodz) Koenigreich Poland/South Prussia, Gruenstadt Bavaria (Worms Germany), Westlau Germany, ?Neubrandenburg, Mecklenburg-Strelitz Prussia/Germany NAMES: Bettger, Boettcher, Huhn, Schindler, Heuter -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of F&RM Haddad Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 11:11 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] naming patterns I've been hearing a lot of late about determining naming patterns, and the help that can be in genealogical research. Does anyone know if there were naming patterns generally used among the Germans - either in Poland or Volhynia? (And for me - Wuerttemberg, Germany). Where does one find out about naming patterns, (serves me right for being timid about asking when I attend lectures/seminars). Rose-Marie _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Mon, 21 Dec 2009 19:04:11 +0100 From: G?nther B?hm Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Ortssuche - Dunaj or Dunaje near ????????Beruany? To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Message-ID: <4B2FB89B.500 at ish.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Elly Huhle schrieb: > Hello, my name is Elly, I live in Canada and are searching for my Polish ancestors. > I have a copy of a church record (marriage) from 1834 entered in the Kath. Church in Lhuta, Czech Republic (formerly Bohemia). > It is stated in this record that the groom is from Russian Poland, a small place called Dunaj or Dunaje near ?Beruany or Breczany or Breyany. The writing is very bad and on top of it are the places written different in several documents. > Todate I was not able to locate this place and hope that perhaps someone from the mailing list has heard of it. > The name of my ancestor is Stepan Mazurkiewicz born in the year 1794. > > In a seperate document dated also in 1834 referring to my above mentioned ancestor and his upcoming marriage (located in the archive of the parish of Libice) is written, ?that the groom is from Russian Poland and has agreed to stay in Libice, Bohemia once the war has ended. > Would anyone know what war was going on at that time? > At this point I have exhausted my resources including maps, Google and ShtetlSeeker and hope that one of the members has heard of such a place. > > Many thanks > > Elly Huhle > ? Hello Elly, Brze?any [now Berezany] was a district capital in the former Austrian "Kronland Galizien", not in Russian Poland. But I can't find any Dunaj od Dunaje nearby. A Francziszek MAZURKIEWICZ lived in Wiktor?wka near Kozowa [Kozova], Brze?any district. This Wiktor?wka is 20 km east of Brze?any. About halfway between them is a village Dubszcze [now Dybsce]. This is the most similar name I can find in the environment of Brze?any. G?nther ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia mailing list, hosted by the: Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe ?http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv.html End of Ger-Poland-Volhynia Digest, Vol 79, Issue 11 *************************************************** From jacbeck56 at gmail.com Fri Jan 29 09:11:58 2010 From: jacbeck56 at gmail.com (jacqueline beckerle) Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 12:11:58 -0500 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] History of town called STREU on the island of Rugen, Germany Message-ID: <84FF4411-5CF1-48A7-BD75-9B0F103D2F05@gmail.com> I am seeking information on a town called Streu on the island of Rugen, Germany. The family name I am researching is Streu and am curious if there might be a connection? It is located on the fringe of Germany, close to Poland, so I thought maybe our organization would cover it. Could some one give me guidance in where to look? Thank you in advance. Jackie Beckerle From kopetzke at gmx.net Fri Jan 29 10:22:15 2010 From: kopetzke at gmx.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Irene_K=F6nig?=) Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 19:22:15 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Location In-Reply-To: <4373EDDA49A24B93B082680FDFE15F91@studyoct21> References: <4373EDDA49A24B93B082680FDFE15F91@studyoct21> Message-ID: <4B632757.1090506@gmx.net> my_ancestors schrieb am 29.01.2010 04:21 Uhr: > "In the Petrokvskaya Gubernia Grezinskogo Uyezda of gl... Mrog > according to leave service evidence from the 7th of May 1880 #4264". Dwayne, This was most probably Piotrk?w Gubernia (Piotrkow Trybunalski), Brzeziny Uyesd, Mroga Gorna or Mroga Dolna. The last is only a guess for your *gl... Mrog*. Some links: http://www.sggee.org/research/parishes/parish_histories/LodzDiocese/BrzezinyParish/BrzezinyParishHistory.html http://www.armin-zimmermann.eu/Bessarabien/Bilder/Karten/Polen_Kirchspiel_Brzeziny.html http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mroga_G%C3%B3rna --- Irene K?nig From gary at warnerengineering.com Fri Jan 29 11:16:00 2010 From: gary at warnerengineering.com (Gary Warner) Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 11:16:00 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Location In-Reply-To: <4B632757.1090506@gmx.net> References: <4373EDDA49A24B93B082680FDFE15F91@studyoct21> <4B632757.1090506@gmx.net> Message-ID: <4B6333F0.7060308@warnerengineering.com> Dwayne, The part of the entry that takes about "leave" sounds much like an entry in my grandfather's military papers when he had leave to visit home. Was the person you seek in the military? If so, the place may only be the place he was stationed. Gary Warner On 1/29/2010 10:22 AM, Irene K?nig wrote: > my_ancestors schrieb am 29.01.2010 04:21 Uhr: > >> "In the Petrokvskaya Gubernia Grezinskogo Uyezda of gl... Mrog >> according to leave service evidence from the 7th of May 1880 #4264". >> > Dwayne, > > This was most probably Piotrk?w Gubernia (Piotrkow Trybunalski), > Brzeziny Uyesd, Mroga Gorna or Mroga Dolna. The last is only a guess for > your *gl... Mrog*. > > Some links: > > http://www.sggee.org/research/parishes/parish_histories/LodzDiocese/BrzezinyParish/BrzezinyParishHistory.html > > http://www.armin-zimmermann.eu/Bessarabien/Bilder/Karten/Polen_Kirchspiel_Brzeziny.html > > http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mroga_G%C3%B3rna > > --- > Irene K?nig > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > From joepessarra at suddenlink.net Fri Jan 29 11:58:07 2010 From: joepessarra at suddenlink.net (joepessarra) Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 13:58:07 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] History of town called STREU on the island of Rugen, Germany In-Reply-To: <84FF4411-5CF1-48A7-BD75-9B0F103D2F05@gmail.com> References: <84FF4411-5CF1-48A7-BD75-9B0F103D2F05@gmail.com> Message-ID: <001d01caa11d$604ef030$20ecd090$@net> -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of jacqueline beckerle Sent: Friday, January 29, 2010 11:12 AM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] History of town called STREU on the island of Rugen, Germany I am seeking information on a town called Streu on the island of Rugen, Germany. The family name I am researching is Streu and am curious if there might be a connection? It is located on the fringe of Germany, close to Poland, so I thought maybe our organization would cover it. Could some one give me guidance in where to look? Thank you in advance. Jackie Beckerle ================================================================= There are two Streu towns in Germany. 1.Streu, Bergen auf R?gen 2.Streu, Schaprode The first one, as you note, is on the island of R?gen. The second one is about 20 km (12 miles) northwest of the first one. You can use Multimap at http://www.multimap.com/ to locate the two towns. Germany telephone directory at http://www2.dastelefonbuch.de/ has some 168 entries for Streu; 117 residential, and 51 business. Streu, Bergen auf R?gen has the postal code of 18528. Streu, Schaprode has the postal code of 18569. None of the phone entries has the same postal code, and there are none in the 185XX codes, but there are some in 18XXX, as well as 17XXX and 19XXX, or nearby towns. There are 6 listings in Rostock, 18XXX codes, which is only about 100 km (60 miles) from Bergen auf R?gen. I did not check all of the listings, but there could be some that are closer to the island. You might check these out. Letters to some of these people might get you some more information about your surname. Could not find any historical info to help you on matching the surname with the town. Good luck. Joe in Texas From kander25 at cableone.net Fri Jan 29 13:20:28 2010 From: kander25 at cableone.net (kander25@cableone.net) Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2010 14:20:28 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] History of town called STREU on the island of Rugen, Germany Message-ID: <61006.1264800028@cableone.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://eclipse.sggee.org/pipermail/ger-poland-volhynia/attachments/20100129/c90518d6/attachment.html From reiner at miericke.net Sat Jan 30 02:40:55 2010 From: reiner at miericke.net (Reiner Miericke) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 11:40:55 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Availability of parish records Message-ID: <201001301140.55651.reiner@miericke.net> Hello again some beginners questions. 1. Parish records (St. Peterberg, ODESSA-DB): My understanding is that - despite of the lost of most Kantorats-books - the church books (as copied by the Pastor) should be more or less complete. When searching for my relatives I am absolutely puzzled for not finding most of them. Example: My grand-grandfather Julius Scherfer married 1. oo Karoline (Carolina) R?ske (Reske): 1. kown child Bertha 7.12.1878 2. oo Amalie Banik: 1. (of two) known child Karl 6.2.1900 3. oo Justine (Justina) Radke, maiden name "Meister": no additional childs I can't find ONE of these marriages Also ot found: Josef Radke oo Justine Meister (about 1850-1870) What I can see are a couple of their children [ODESSA-DB]. Thesepersons were all reliogious Lutheranians and I can't imagine why the according marriage records are not in the church books. Any hints? 2. When checking entries in ODESSA and comparing these to the church books using pilot.familysearch.org I found some mis-readings. Where should I send corrections to? -- Mit freundlichen Gr?ssen Reiner Miericke From textor_jan at hotmail.com Sat Jan 30 03:14:33 2010 From: textor_jan at hotmail.com (Jan Textor) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 12:14:33 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Availability of parish records In-Reply-To: <201001301140.55651.reiner@miericke.net> References: <201001301140.55651.reiner@miericke.net> Message-ID: Reiner, The Odessa3 Search Engine shows a.o. the death of Adolph Schaerfer on 17 Sep 1881 at Chonti Bresalup, Kr. Lutzk, parents Julius and Caroline. The remarks are: Age, 5 yr.,3 mo. Mother's maiden name, Roeske. Born in Petrikau. It seems that this child was born about June, 1876 in Petrikau. I assume this is Piotrkow Trybunalski, and I also suspect that Julius and Caroline were married before 1876 and not in Volhynia, but somewhere in Congress (or Russian) Poland, probably Petrikau. I think that is the reason why you cannot find their marriage record in the Odessa records. Hope this helps. Jan Textor > From: reiner at miericke.net > To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 11:40:55 +0100 > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Availability of parish records > > Hello > > again some beginners questions. > > 1. Parish records (St. Peterberg, ODESSA-DB): > My understanding is that - despite of the lost of most Kantorats-books - the > church books (as copied by the Pastor) should be more or less complete. When > searching for my relatives I am absolutely puzzled for not finding most of > them. > Example: > My grand-grandfather Julius Scherfer married > 1. oo Karoline (Carolina) R?ske (Reske): 1. kown child Bertha 7.12.1878 > 2. oo Amalie Banik: 1. (of two) known child Karl 6.2.1900 > 3. oo Justine (Justina) Radke, maiden name "Meister": no additional childs > > I can't find ONE of these marriages > > Also ot found: > Josef Radke oo Justine Meister (about 1850-1870) > > What I can see are a couple of their children [ODESSA-DB]. > > Thesepersons were all reliogious Lutheranians and I can't imagine why the > according marriage records are not in the church books. > Any hints? > > > 2. When checking entries in ODESSA and comparing these to the church books > using pilot.familysearch.org I found some mis-readings. Where should I send > corrections to? > > -- > Mit freundlichen Gr?ssen > Reiner Miericke > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From reiner at miericke.net Sat Jan 30 03:32:22 2010 From: reiner at miericke.net (Reiner Miericke) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 12:32:22 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Availability of parish records In-Reply-To: References: <201001301140.55651.reiner@miericke.net> Message-ID: <201001301232.23039.reiner@miericke.net> Thanks for your reply, Jan yes, I can see a couple of children and it might be the case that the first marriage happend somewhere else. But then Julius Scherfer/Sch?rfer settled in Jamki (agrarian), had a lot children and the second and third wife brought their own children into the family. The question is: Is the list of marriages seen at ODESSA expected to be (more or less) complete? Am Samstag, 30. Januar 2010 12:14:33 schrieben Sie: > Reiner, > > > > The Odessa3 Search Engine shows a.o. the death of Adolph Schaerfer on 17 > Sep 1881 at Chonti Bresalup, Kr. Lutzk, parents Julius and Caroline. The > remarks are: Age, 5 yr.,3 mo. Mother's maiden name, Roeske. Born in > Petrikau. > > > It seems that this child was born about June, 1876 in Petrikau. I assume > this is Piotrkow Trybunalski, and I also suspect that Julius and Caroline > were married before 1876 and not in Volhynia, but somewhere in Congress (or > Russian) Poland, probably Petrikau. I think that is the reason why you > cannot find their marriage record in the Odessa records. > > > > Hope this helps. > > > > Jan Textor > > > From: reiner at miericke.net > > To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org > > Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 11:40:55 +0100 > > Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Availability of parish records > > > > Hello > > > > again some beginners questions. > > > > 1. Parish records (St. Peterberg, ODESSA-DB): > > My understanding is that - despite of the lost of most Kantorats-books - > > the church books (as copied by the Pastor) should be more or less > > complete. When searching for my relatives I am absolutely puzzled for not > > finding most of them. > > Example: > > My grand-grandfather Julius Scherfer married > > 1. oo Karoline (Carolina) R?ske (Reske): 1. kown child Bertha 7.12.1878 > > 2. oo Amalie Banik: 1. (of two) known child Karl 6.2.1900 > > 3. oo Justine (Justina) Radke, maiden name "Meister": no additional > > childs > > > > I can't find ONE of these marriages > > > > Also ot found: > > Josef Radke oo Justine Meister (about 1850-1870) > > > > What I can see are a couple of their children [ODESSA-DB]. > > > > Thesepersons were all reliogious Lutheranians and I can't imagine why the > > according marriage records are not in the church books. > > Any hints? > > > > > > 2. When checking entries in ODESSA and comparing these to the church > > books using pilot.familysearch.org I found some mis-readings. Where > > should I send corrections to? > > > > -- > > Mit freundlichen Gr?ssen > > Reiner Miericke > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv -- Mit freundlichen Gr?ssen Reiner Miericke From my_ancestors at telus.net Sat Jan 30 07:04:10 2010 From: my_ancestors at telus.net (my_ancestors) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 08:04:10 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Location In-Reply-To: <4B6333F0.7060308@warnerengineering.com> References: <4373EDDA49A24B93B082680FDFE15F91@studyoct21> <4B632757.1090506@gmx.net> <4B6333F0.7060308@warnerengineering.com> Message-ID: Gary/Irene, Thanks for the information on the location. I do not know the context of the leave, so I have added two documents from the Zhitomir Archives to the website under the following URL, in case someone could shed further light on this. It could be as you say, his discharge from the military allowing him the opportunity to leave and immigrate to Volhynia. Could it also be just the release from Polish emigration officials? If you can read Russian, I can forward to you a higher definition of the documents. Dwayne http://sites.google.com/site/dmtfamilyhistory/home/volhynia/christov-tiede-d ocuments From ivanteise at gmail.com Sat Jan 30 08:11:53 2010 From: ivanteise at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Iv=E1n_Teise?=) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 13:11:53 -0300 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Availability of parish records In-Reply-To: <201001301232.23039.reiner@miericke.net> References: <201001301140.55651.reiner@miericke.net> <201001301232.23039.reiner@miericke.net> Message-ID: <713a0811001300811j7651ce5hf1b448e7f67a9f86@mail.gmail.com> Hello Reiner, Reinhold Schaerfer is one of the children of Julius and Karoline and was born in 1885, so the second marriage of Julius took place after this year. You are not able to find this because the Odessa database covers the years up to 1885. Regards, Iv?n Teise From reiner at miericke.net Sat Jan 30 08:46:56 2010 From: reiner at miericke.net (Reiner Miericke) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 17:46:56 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Availability of parish records In-Reply-To: <713a0811001300811j7651ce5hf1b448e7f67a9f86@mail.gmail.com> References: <201001301140.55651.reiner@miericke.net> <201001301232.23039.reiner@miericke.net> <713a0811001300811j7651ce5hf1b448e7f67a9f86@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <201001301746.57075.reiner@miericke.net> Hello Ivan yes, there are reasons why some marriages can't appear in ODESSA. The range of covered years is quite small. Thanks! > Hello Reiner, > > Reinhold Schaerfer is one of the children of Julius and Karoline and was > born in 1885, so the second marriage of Julius took place after this year. > You are not able to find this because the Odessa database covers the years > up to 1885. > > Regards, > > Iv?n Teise > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv -- Mit freundlichen Gr?ssen Reiner Miericke From gary at warnerengineering.com Sat Jan 30 08:43:05 2010 From: gary at warnerengineering.com (Gary Warner) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 08:43:05 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Availability of parish records In-Reply-To: <201001301140.55651.reiner@miericke.net> References: <201001301140.55651.reiner@miericke.net> Message-ID: <4B646199.1070004@warnerengineering.com> Reiner, If I use the SGGEE version of the Odessa file that is located at http://sggee.org/research/PublicDatabases, I also do not see any marriages for Julius, but I do see births as follows Schaerfer Wilhelm Friedrich 1-Oct 1880 Romanow l Rozyszcze Julius Caroline Roerke 1897588-2/1880 353 1407 Schaerfer Reinhold 29-Jun 1885 Kuti Rozyszcze Julius Karoline Roeske 1897692-1/1885 347 1324 Schaerfer Rudolf 12-Jul 1887 Konti-Bresalup Rozyszcze Julius Caroline Roeske 2380020/1887 181 1459 Scherfer Erdman 12-Jun 1882 Bresalup Rozyszcze Julius Carolina Roeske 1897596-1/1882 754 1101 Scherfer Bertha 7-Dec 1878 Bresalup Rozyszcze Julius Caroline Borke 1897588-2/1880 324 1054 Note the varying spelling of Julius' surname, and also the last entry that shows Caroline's surname as Borke, which is likely an extraction error. I also see deaths as follows Schaerfer Adolph 17 Sep 1881 Rozyszcze "Chonti Bresalup, Kr. Lutzk" Julius Roeske Caroline 1897594/1 515 769 Schaerfer Wilhelm 17 Sep 1881 Rozyszcze "Chonti Bresalup, Kr. Lutzk" Julius Roeske Caroline 1897594/1 515 770 Gary Warner On 1/30/2010 2:40 AM, Reiner Miericke wrote: > Hello > > again some beginners questions. > > 1. Parish records (St. Peterberg, ODESSA-DB): > My understanding is that - despite of the lost of most Kantorats-books - the > church books (as copied by the Pastor) should be more or less complete. When > searching for my relatives I am absolutely puzzled for not finding most of > them. > Example: > My grand-grandfather Julius Scherfer married > 1. oo Karoline (Carolina) R?ske (Reske): 1. kown child Bertha 7.12.1878 > 2. oo Amalie Banik: 1. (of two) known child Karl 6.2.1900 > 3. oo Justine (Justina) Radke, maiden name "Meister": no additional childs > > I can't find ONE of these marriages > > Also ot found: > Josef Radke oo Justine Meister (about 1850-1870) > > What I can see are a couple of their children [ODESSA-DB]. > > Thesepersons were all reliogious Lutheranians and I can't imagine why the > according marriage records are not in the church books. > Any hints? > > > 2. When checking entries in ODESSA and comparing these to the church books > using pilot.familysearch.org I found some mis-readings. Where should I send > corrections to? > > From gary at warnerengineering.com Sat Jan 30 08:46:41 2010 From: gary at warnerengineering.com (Gary Warner) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 08:46:41 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Location In-Reply-To: References: <4373EDDA49A24B93B082680FDFE15F91@studyoct21> <4B632757.1090506@gmx.net> <4B6333F0.7060308@warnerengineering.com> Message-ID: <4B646271.9030505@warnerengineering.com> Dwayne, The link that you sent does not work. Gary On 1/30/2010 7:04 AM, my_ancestors wrote: > Gary/Irene, > Thanks for the information on the location. I do not know the context of the > leave, so I have added two documents from the Zhitomir Archives to the > website under the following URL, in case someone could shed further light on > this. It could be as you say, his discharge from the military allowing him > the opportunity to leave and immigrate to Volhynia. Could it also be just > the release from Polish emigration officials? > If you can read Russian, I can forward to you a higher definition of the > documents. > Dwayne > http://sites.google.com/site/dmtfamilyhistory/home/volhynia/christov-tiede-d > ocuments > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From my_ancestors at telus.net Sat Jan 30 08:53:25 2010 From: my_ancestors at telus.net (my_ancestors) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 09:53:25 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Location References: <4373EDDA49A24B93B082680FDFE15F91@studyoct21> <4B632757.1090506@gmx.net> <4B6333F0.7060308@warnerengineering.com> Message-ID: Here is another try as the formatting cut off the complete URL. Dwayne Gary/Irene, Thanks for the information on the location. I do not know the context of the leave, so I have added two documents from the Zhitomir Archives to the website under the following URL, in case someone could shed further light on this. It could be as you say, his discharge from the military allowing him the opportunity to leave and immigrate to Volhynia. Could it also be just the release from Polish emigration officials? If you can read Russian, I can forward to you a higher definition of the documents. Dwayne http://sites.google.com/site/dmtfamilyhistory/home/volhynia/ From karlann at juno.com Sat Jan 30 08:58:19 2010 From: karlann at juno.com (karlann@juno.com) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 16:58:19 GMT Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Petrikau Message-ID: <20100130.085819.23184.0@webmail06.vgs.untd.com> I recently read this comment in a post "It seems that this child was born about June, 1876 in Petrikau. I assume this is Piotrkow Trybunalski"-- There are other possibilities when a record mentions "Petrikau"--there is a large region of Poland near Lodz that was called Petrikau, and many Lutheran records must be searched to find which parish has the record of an event. For years I had no idea where in "Petrikau" to find records of births and marriages, and when I searched the SGGEE parish records database, I found them indexed in Belchatow. So I recommend searching the SGGEE parish records database for Poland if you are hoping to find something in "Petrikau." Karla Walters ____________________________________________________________ Small Business Tools Compete with the big boys. Click here to find products to benefit your business. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=g3FFlJuTX-cQHD_v-B8a3wAAJ1CS0IOSs1YHQ0pNjwb5J_aXAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARMQAAAAA= From reiner at miericke.net Sat Jan 30 09:17:51 2010 From: reiner at miericke.net (Reiner Miericke) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 18:17:51 +0100 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Petrikau In-Reply-To: <20100130.085819.23184.0@webmail06.vgs.untd.com> References: <20100130.085819.23184.0@webmail06.vgs.untd.com> Message-ID: <201001301817.51420.reiner@miericke.net> Hallo Karla useful tip! My Julius Scherfer was born in Galowek (near Lodz) and his first wife Caroline R?ske is known to be born in Petrikau. So that mean to me that they probably also married in the region of Lodz. Thanks! n?tzlicher Hinweis! Ich habe da einen Julius Scherfer, stammend aus Am Samstag, 30. Januar 2010 17:58:19 schrieb karlann at juno.com: > I recently read this comment in a post > > "It seems that this child was born about June, 1876 in Petrikau. I assume > this is Piotrkow Trybunalski"-- > > There are other possibilities when a record mentions "Petrikau"--there is a > large region of Poland near Lodz that was called Petrikau, and many > Lutheran records must be searched to find which parish has the record of an > event. For years I had no idea where in "Petrikau" to find records of > births and marriages, and when I searched the SGGEE parish records > database, I found them indexed in Belchatow. > > So I recommend searching the SGGEE parish records database for Poland if > you are hoping to find something in "Petrikau." > > Karla Walters > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Small Business Tools > Compete with the big boys. Click here to find products to benefit your > business. > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=g3FFlJuTX-cQHD_v-B8a3wAAJ1CS0 >IOSs1YHQ0pNjwb5J_aXAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARMQAAAAA= > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv -- Mit freundlichen Gr?ssen Reiner Miericke From edieadam at gmail.com Sat Jan 30 14:09:50 2010 From: edieadam at gmail.com (Edie Adam) Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 17:09:50 -0500 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Stumpp village reports in captured German records Message-ID: Hello all: Can anyone confirm that the village reports done by Karl Stumpp in the Ukraine during WWII are in the captured German records held at the U.S. Archives? I am trying to track down the original microfilm after finding a paper copy in the SGGEE library at the convention last summer. But the staff at the Archives is not able to help. Any clues to pulling the microfilm are appreciated! Edie Adam Virginia, USA From FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca Sun Jan 31 09:47:36 2010 From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca (Jerry Frank) Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 10:47:36 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] St. Pete Images on Pilot Site have been moved Message-ID: <4B65C238.6080201@shaw.ca> Some folks may be having trouble finding these records at the Family Search pilot site. That is because there were previously misfiled under "Asia", which is an incorrect geographical designation. Western Russia is fully in Europe. So - they can now be found where they should be under Europe. Our own St. Pete Search Pages will continue to carry the incorrect designation for a few weeks as we are doing a major descriptive update. The link to the site is still accurate. -- Jerry Frank SGGEE Webmaster Calgary, AB From FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca Sun Jan 31 09:56:40 2010 From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca (Jerry Frank) Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 10:56:40 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Stumpp village reports in captured German records In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B65C458.4030002@shaw.ca> These records were indeed from the captured German records held at US Archives. They were buried deep within a whole bunch of other stuff so the Archives may not be able to identify a specific request to see them. Dale Wahl (deceased) purchased a copy of the microfilm which we borrowed to extract the info. His materials are now in the library of the Germans from Russia Heritage Society in Bismarck, ND http://www.grhs.org . I know that he had a bunch of these films which he tagged with descriptive indexes. Only one that I am aware of had Volhynian materials. They may be able to help you identify the exact film number. I believe that I photocopied all Volhynia related materials from this film and that should be in our SGGEE Library. I may not have but I should have also photocopied the relevant title page for the film so Howard Krushel might be able to help with that as well. Jerry Frank Calgary, AB Edie Adam wrote: > Hello all: Can anyone confirm that the village reports done by Karl Stumpp > in the Ukraine during WWII are in the captured German records held at the > U.S. Archives? > > I am trying to track down the original microfilm after finding a paper copy > in the SGGEE library at the convention last summer. But the staff at the > Archives is not able to help. > > Any clues to pulling the microfilm are appreciated! > > Edie Adam > Virginia, USA > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > > From traveljazz at sbcglobal.net Sun Jan 31 13:04:30 2010 From: traveljazz at sbcglobal.net (Susan and Joe Cadena) Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 13:04:30 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Josefin + Heinrichsgeorge Message-ID: <000c01caa2b8$fb5c1ac0$f2145040$@net> Hello all, A possible relation has written me that her grandfather was born in 1895 in Josefin Heinrichsgeorge. I know there were a number of villages named Josefin, but Heinrichsgeorge is a new location to me. Can anyone enlighten me? Thank you - Susan Cadena From joretired at telus.net Sun Jan 31 13:40:12 2010 From: joretired at telus.net (Josephine Herndler) Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 21:40:12 -0000 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Hoffman/Kaidennak Message-ID: My gr. grandfather Traugott Hoffman was born 17 April 1854 in Przybyszow, Noworadomsk, Piotrkow, parish of Kobiele wieikic in Poland. At age 14 he went with his family to Volyynia where he married Karoline Kaidannek. Where would I write to find the parents of Traugott and the marriage of Traugott and Karoline? In 1899 he was with his family in Manitoba. He later farmed in Libau Manitoba. To date I cannot find either on the St. Petersburg records or any databases I have looked at. Thanks for any helo anyone can give me, Josephine Herndler From colnels at telus.net Sun Jan 31 13:59:35 2010 From: colnels at telus.net (Nelson Itterman) Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 14:59:35 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Hoffman/Kaidennak In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000501caa2c0$ad3fa390$07beeab0$@net> Were they Lutherans? Nelson -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Josephine Herndler Sent: February-20-03 6:52 AM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Hoffman/Kaidennak My gr. grandfather Traugott Hoffman was born 17 April 1854 in Przybyszow, Noworadomsk, Piotrkow, parish of Kobiele wieikic in Poland. At age 14 he went with his family to Volyynia where he married Karoline Kaidannek. Where would I write to find the parents of Traugott and the marriage of Traugott and Karoline? In 1899 he was with his family in Manitoba. He later farmed in Libau Manitoba. To date I cannot find either on the St. Petersburg records or any databases I have looked at. Thanks for any helo anyone can give me, Josephine Herndler _______________________________________________ Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv From joepessarra at suddenlink.net Sun Jan 31 14:16:24 2010 From: joepessarra at suddenlink.net (joepessarra) Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 16:16:24 -0600 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Josefin + Heinrichsgeorge In-Reply-To: <000c01caa2b8$fb5c1ac0$f2145040$@net> References: <000c01caa2b8$fb5c1ac0$f2145040$@net> Message-ID: <000301caa2c3$06eb3240$14c196c0$@net> -----Original Message----- From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Susan and Joe Cadena Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 3:05 PM To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Josefin + Heinrichsgeorge Hello all, A possible relation has written me that her grandfather was born in 1895 in Josefin Heinrichsgeorge. I know there were a number of villages named Josefin, but Heinrichsgeorge is a new location to me. Can anyone enlighten me? Thank you - Susan Cadena ======================================================================= Using ShetlSeeker at http://www.jewishgen.org/Communities/LocTown.asp we find at least one possibility: Heinrichsh?tte, Althammer Gosch?tz, Ku?nia Goszcza?ska populated place 51?24' N 17?28' E E M U G Poland 161.8 miles WSW of Warszawa 52?15' N 21?0' E Closest Josefina, allowing for misspelling: J?zefina populated place 51?49' N 18?17' E E M U G Poland 45.3 miles NE of 51?24' N 17?28' E But, looking for towns in Poland beginning with "Heinrichs", we found 7 of them. Using the coordinates for each of them in order, we looked for Josefin and found the closest possibility for each of them. Possible towns, allowing for misspelling of town names, we found: Chosczewen, Choszczewo, Choszewen, Hohensee populated place 53?53' N 21?05' E E M U G Poland 6.4 miles WNW of 53?50' N 21?13' E This town is only 6.4 miles away from: Heinrichsdorf, Janowen, Janowo populated place 53?50' N 21?13' E E M U G Poland 109.7 miles N of Warszawa 52?15' N 21?0' E Someone else may be able to give you better directions for your search. Good luck, Joe in Texas From rakow at ifh.de Sun Jan 31 14:19:54 2010 From: rakow at ifh.de (Paul Rakow) Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 23:19:54 +0100 (CET) Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Stumpp village reports in captured German records In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Edie, There is a list of village reports with the container and film reel numbers at http://www.odessa3.org/collections/war/reports/link/cgdback.txt (prepared by Dale Wahl). It looks like you should go to the Library of Congress instead of the National Archives. Take a print-out of the linked background document when you go. Hope this helps, Paul Rakow rakow at ifh.de "Edie Adam" wrote: > > Hello all: Can anyone confirm that the village reports done by Karl Stumpp > in the Ukraine during WWII are in the captured German records held at the > U.S. Archives? > > I am trying to track down the original microfilm after finding a paper copy > in the SGGEE library at the convention last summer. But the staff at the > Archives is not able to help. > > Any clues to pulling the microfilm are appreciated! > > Edie Adam > Virginia, USA > From gary at warnerengineering.com Sun Jan 31 15:07:25 2010 From: gary at warnerengineering.com (Gary Warner) Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 15:07:25 -0800 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Hoffman/Kaidennak In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B660D2D.5020809@warnerengineering.com> Josephine, First, you need to change your computer's clock- it is giving dates from 2003. Second, it appears that the closest Lutheran parish to Przybyszow is Dziep???, which was apparently formed in 1841 (our scanned maps page oddly shows the formation date as 1843). You can order the film from your local Family History Center using the numbers in the second film shown at http://www.familysearch.org/eng/library/fhlcatalog/supermainframeset.asp?display=titlefilmnotes&columns=*%2C0%2C0&titleno=256106&disp=Kopie+ksi%C4%99g+metrykalnych++ The film should be in Polish. If he really married in Volhynia, there will only be a listing of the name of the bride and groom and the wedding date. I do not, however, see the marriage in the St. Petersburg data. That being the case, you will probably want to look for the marriage in the Dziep??? records, since family legends may not be correct as to the place of marriage. Gary Warner On 2/20/2003 5:51 AM, Josephine Herndler wrote: > My gr. grandfather Traugott Hoffman was born 17 April 1854 in Przybyszow, Noworadomsk, Piotrkow, parish of Kobiele wieikic in Poland. At age 14 he went with his family to Volyynia where he married Karoline Kaidannek. Where would I write to find the parents of Traugott and the marriage of Traugott and Karoline? In 1899 he was with his family in Manitoba. He later farmed in Libau Manitoba. To date I cannot find either on the St. Petersburg records or any databases I have looked at. Thanks for any helo anyone can give me, Josephine Herndler > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > From FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca Sun Jan 31 18:31:05 2010 From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca (Jerry Frank) Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 19:31:05 -0700 Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Josefin + Heinrichsgeorge In-Reply-To: <000c01caa2b8$fb5c1ac0$f2145040$@net> References: <000c01caa2b8$fb5c1ac0$f2145040$@net> Message-ID: <4B663CE9.3090908@shaw.ca> Heinrichsgeorge is clearly an error. More info is required for us to help. Is this in Poland, Volhynia, or ??? What names are associated with this location? Any other documents or lore that would narrow down the possibilities? Jerry Frank Calgary, AB Susan and Joe Cadena wrote: > Hello all, > > > > A possible relation has written me that her grandfather was born in 1895 in > Josefin Heinrichsgeorge. I know there were a number of villages named > Josefin, but Heinrichsgeorge is a new location to me. Can anyone enlighten > me? > > Thank you - > > Susan Cadena > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by > Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org > Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv > >